Putting The United Back Into The United States: Karina Quintans of JebelWorks On The 5 Things That Each Of Us Can Do To Help Unite Our Polarized Society
Engage with each other as human beings, instead of political beings. Politics is important. But politics will never define my relationships. My personal version of “country over party” is “relationships over politics”.
As part of our series about 5 Things That Each Of Us Can Do To Help Unite Our Polarized Society, I had the pleasure of interviewing Karina Quintans.
Karina is a self-employed content writer and photographer based in Portsmouth, New Hampshire, specializing in marketing and communications for government/defense contractors. A third culture kid, she was born in Boston to Filipino immigrant parents, and raised in the Middle East, South America, and Europe. She has continued to travel around the world for work and pleasure (to date, she has traveled to at least 48 countries and lived/worked in 8 of the 48). After delivering a successful Creative Mornings talk in 2019 focused on finding humanity in everyday life while traveling, Karina was invited to audition for TEDx Portsmouth to share her story (currently on hold due to the pandemic).
Thank you so much for joining us in this interview series! Before we dive into the main focus of our interview, our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your childhood backstory?
Though I rarely use the term, I identify as a Third Culture Kid (TCK), having spent much of my upbringing living in cultures other than my parents’ Filipino culture and the American culture into which I was born. I became a TCK at ten years old when my family moved to Saudi Arabia in 1977. My father had taken a job with a large engineering and construction firm and was assigned to a project that would transform a small fishing town on the eastern coast of Saudi Arabia into an industrial port. To this day, this project is known as one of the largest infrastructure projects ever undertaken in the world.
Our mid-summer arrival in Saudi gave us a few weeks to get settled and familiar with our surroundings before school began. We moved into a gated compound where only expats lived, and began adjusting to the desert heat, and Thursdays and Fridays as our weekend.
But more novel was learning the myriad rules of living in the most conservative Muslim country in the world. Religious practices. Dress codes. Public behavior. Freedom. For instance, during the Islamic holy week of Ramadan, no one could eat or drink outside of their home. There were no churches for a Catholic Filipino family such as ours to attend mass on Sundays since the practice of any religion other than Islam was illegal. Women had to be wardrobe sensitive, covering arms, legs, and ankles and avoid tight clothing. Our moms could not drive, nor could they work, except in the school. Public displays of affection were prohibited between men and women, whether married or not. Males were forbidden to mingle or talk with single females.
There was the getting used to the absence of anything American. Most western consumables, if any, were from Great Britain. There was soda but instead of Coke, Orange Fanta, and Sprite, we had Pepsi, Mirinda, and Teem. And of course, there were no pork products nor alcohol — both forbidden in the Muslim culture.
There were also no malls, movie theaters, bookstores, nor nightlife for anyone — especially not for the hundreds of expat men on “single status” (bachelors or married without family in country). Single expat women were not allowed in the country. Deprived socially, men on “single status” were granted more vacation time outside of the country than those on “family status”.
I was apprehensive about moving to Saudi. I was ten years old and it just sounded scary. But over time, we settled into a rhythm. And I surprisingly came to love our Saudi life, mostly because of friends. Friends representing cultures from almost every continent, and with whom I spent every free minute, as we watched an industrial city rise from the desert sand. Friends with whom I compared notes about the cool vacations our families took to Europe, Africa, and Asia, and what new American trendy clothing we had purchased during our annual visits back to the U.S.
To the friends we left back home our life in the most conservative Muslim country sounded incomprehensible. But the reality was, our expat life was rich with culture, adventure, fun, and deep friendships. We made so much of the little we had in late 70s Saudi. And ultimately, our life in Saudi Arabia came to be my most defining event because it shaped every aspect of the rest of my life, as well as my worldview that we are all the same, no matter what country we come from.
What or who inspired you to pursue your career? We’d love to hear the story.
My father inspired me to pursue a career in engineering. I loved the opportunities we had to travel to unique places and live overseas because of his job with the largest privately-owned engineering and construction firm. I also seemed to do slightly better in math and science than in other subjects. I worked hard at my college application and was accepted into my number one choice — Worcester Polytechnic Institute.
Once matriculated, however, I soon realized I was in the wrong place yet did not transfer until my junior year. I finished my undergraduate studies in Finance at Babson College. At the same time, I got a part time job at the headquarters of a small fast-growing retail business. They hired me as a full-time Budget Analyst upon graduation. I spent five years with this company and knew it was not the end-all be-all of my career. Eventually I made my way to graduate school for a Masters’ Degree in International Affairs to reconnect with my traveling past.
It was during grad school when I realized I enjoyed writing. I then dabbled in writing as part of various contract jobs I had after earning my graduate degree. Every place I worked was a great experience. I learned more about myself and what made me tick. The more I got to write, the more I loved it. But it still took a few more years to find my way into a writing career.
At some point, I put the word out to friends that I was looking for a writing job. In 2005, I was connected to a government proposal consulting group. I began writing proposals to win Department of Defense contracts for small businesses located nationwide and found I had a knack for it. After seven years, I transitioned to employee status with one of my clients. And from there, I blossomed into other areas of marketing and communications where my writing skills were put to good use.
Today, I am a marketing and communications specialist (writer and photographer) for government contractors performing environmental and construction projects nationwide and across the Pacific Region. I work with engineers and scientists as a writer. I have at least 17 published articles in this field of work. I always chuckle when I recall that somehow, I came full circle into a career that involves engineering.
What are some of the most interesting or exciting projects you are working on now? How do you think that might help people?
Promoting the trades — In 2018, I started spending time on construction jobsites with my camera. I enjoy being witness to the incredible skill and knowledge of the tradespeople, and especially love getting to know each of the field crew. It did not take long before I also started to see them as “unsung heroes” of our society and felt moved to highlight their work and their humanity.
I have a photography project I hope to execute, focused on the role of the trades in our national security if I can secure funding. I am also hoping to build my portfolio of photographs, so I can further advocate for the importance of the trades to our society. My goals are in line with those of the Mike Rowe Foundation — to create awareness and greater appreciation for the trades and encourage youth to choose the trades as a viable career path where demand is high, and supply is low.
Promoting our common humanity — I started casually micro-blogging about our common humanity a few years ago through my Instagram account. The political climate drove me to share a few stories about the wonderful relationships and friendships I have with people who are my political opposite. My hope was to show that good relationships are possible outside of our political “tribes”. The stories have resonated with my friends.
Then in 2019, I had the opportunity to present as a Creative Mornings speaker. I shared stories about how my experience growing up and traveling around the world taught me that despite cultural differences and our varying skin colors, we are all human beings with the same basic desires — to live, love, and laugh with our family and friends. And that because of my travel experiences, empathy for others is now ingrained in me.
My inspiration to speak about our common humanity started following 9/11. I wanted to share my story to show that there is no need to fear the “foreign” — those who look different, speak other languages, have different cultural traditions and rituals, religions, etc. And that getting there is easily done by connecting as human beings, sharing in our common humanity and the human condition, as I have done with people around the world.
My Creative Mornings talk resonated with the audience. At the conclusion of my talk, the organizer of TEDx Portsmouth, who was in the audience, invited me to audition for TEDx Portsmouth. Unfortunately, my audition and the event have been postponed by the pandemic. That aside, I believe that the worldview about humanity that I formed from my travels is an important lesson to share given the world we live in today. I am brainstorming ways to continue to share my message.
None of us can achieve success without some help along the way. Was there a particular person who you feel gave you the most help or encouragement to be who you are today? Can you share a story about that?
In general, I attribute my success to everyone I have met along the way, as I have made it a point to learn from many by adopting the habits, behaviors, and approaches to people, life, and work that I have admired in others. This practice started in grad school where I met my friends Karen and Brian who had a big impact on my growth at the time, as well as many years after.
If I had to pick one person, however, it would be my college friend Simone Shields. During the first quarter of graduate school, Simone sent me an Architectural Digest article that completely redirected the focus of my graduate studies and post-graduate work experiences on the use of bamboo as an alternative source of timber to reduce the deforestation of old growth forest. It was fascinating, fun, and exposed me to people from so many countries doing incredible research with bamboo across every sector of work.
A decade later, Simone was the person who connected me to the government proposal consulting group when I was looking for a writing job. This introduction led me into my current career where I am quite happy and thriving.
Lastly, Simone introduced me to Portsmouth, NH where I ended up buying my first home and have lived continuously for 14 years — the longest I have ever lived in one place, and a place that brought back what I had been missing for years — real community. Though I grew up moving around a lot, my family always had strong community around us in each country. Once I returned to the states for college, it took me a long time to find community again. I had plenty of friends, but it was just not the same as the communities we had overseas. I first re-discovered community when I went to graduate school in a small town, where I made friends with my classmates who were also world travelers. But then we graduated and left the university town. It was not until I moved to Portsmouth in 2007, that I again found community.
All told, Simone has singularly had the most impact on my personal and professional life in ways that helped me to realize my authentic self. I often joke about Simone’s role in my life because we were not good friends in college; we simply shared the same circle of friends. Somehow, a few years after college, our friendship evolved, and I came to learn that we share the same worldview. Simone is now like family to me.
Aside from the ways Simone redirected the course of my life, I also learned about compassion and acceptance from her. After college, I repeatedly observed how welcoming and kind she is to people of all personalities and walks of life. Whereas others might ostracize someone, Simone is accepting and inviting, and is sweet and kind-hearted to everyone. These are qualities I deeply admire in her, which speak to my favorite life lesson quote — My religion is simple. My religion is kindness. ~The Dalai Lama
Can you share the funniest or most interesting mistake that occurred to you in the course of your career? What lesson or take away did you learn from that?
In my mid- to upper 30s, I learned the importance of emotional intelligence. I had worked with several organizations where office politics and egos were pervasive, and let my emotions dictate my behavior, actions, and responses to various situations, often overreacting. I lost the respect of some of my co-workers because of it. I am embarrassed when I think back to those hard lessons.
The ability to recognize and name your emotions, to understand how they affect your decisions and behavior, and how to be in control of them is critical to a life comprised of healthy relationships and for success in any endeavor. Lack of emotional intelligence can undermine our professionalism and ability to develop trusting and respectful relationships. Understanding emotions is also helpful in understanding other people’s behaviors and allows us to respond more appropriately and effectively, and perhaps most importantly, with empathy.
Is there a particular book that made a significant impact on you? Can you share a story or explain why it resonated with you so much?
Reading Stephen Levine’s, A Gradual Awakening, was in fact, a huge awakening. It was the beginning of my understanding of emotional intelligence, meditation, and Buddhist practices — all of which have been life altering. I learned about how much I was allowing my thoughts to affect and control my life, and how to separate myself from my thoughts. This learning, which can be a lifelong endeavor/process, is a key part of emotional intelligence.
A friend of mine had recommended the book. I was intrigued and therefore made the purchase. But as I began to read the book, it was not resonating. So, I shelved it, thinking I would one day return to it. I do not remember what made me pick up the book again several years later. But when I did, my experience was completely different. I could not put the book down. From this I also learned that sometimes, you are just not ready for the message that will catalyze the change you need in your life. Hearing a message is often about timing and delivery.
Can you share your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Why does that resonate with you so much? Do you have a story about how that was relevant in your life or your work?
My favorite quote: My religion is simple. My religion is kindness. ~The Dalai Lama
I love this life lesson quote because it is so simple, yet powerful and actionable.
Story — I was raised Catholic, but Catholicism never really resonated with me. Once we moved overseas, I was exposed to other religions during our travels. And because we were not allowed to practice Catholicism while living in Saudi, I began my exit from the religion. I never intentionally replaced it but after reading A Gradual Awakening years later, it opened my eyes to Buddhist practices and teachings, which today, are my life guides (though I do not claim to be Buddhist). Naturally, I made my way into books by the Dalai Lama, and came across his quote “My religion is simple. My religion is kindness.” It was so simple and easy to understand.
This favorite life lesson quote also reminds me of the Golden Rule “Do unto others as you would have them do unto you” — with kindness. If we all started and stayed with kindness when relating to others, I think the world would be a much more pleasant and less divisive place.
My focus on kindness grew when I moved from Boston, MA to Portsmouth, NH where there is a small tight knit community — the very reason I chose to move there. In cities, we can often live with a degree of anonymity. When I moved to Portsmouth, it took me a while to change this mindset, but one experience catalyzed that change. One block from my house is a Mobil Mart where I often went for a $1 cup of coffee. One day, I stopped in for a snack and a lottery ticket. I tried to pay with a credit card but was told lottery tickets had to be paid with cash (I had no cash for my purchase). I was in a bad mood when I walked in the store. I proceeded to take my mood out on the woman at the checkout counter, who I had seen many times before, when she declined my credit card. I left in a huff. Over the course of the next two weeks, I thought about my behavior that day. I knew I would be heading back to the Mobil Mart for coffee and other items and thought about how embarrassed I would be to show my face. I thought to myself — I moved here because I wanted a real community. And this Mobil Mart is part of my community. So, I decidedly went back with the intention of owning up to my behavior. Luckily, the same gal was at the counter that day as I had hoped she would be, and this is what I said: “I was here a couple of weeks ago and was completely rude to you. I took my bad mood out on you. I just wanted to say I am very sorry. I come here often and my behavior that day was not acceptable.” In response, the gal told me she was not sure she remembered the encounter but thanked me for owning up to my behavior, stating that no one ever comes back to apologize. For the next two years, she never charged me for a cup of coffee. And I proceeded to remain cognizant of being kind to everyone in my community. It is a mindset that also became important as I grew to become a community leader over the next ten years, and developed working relationships with local government leaders, city department managers, and other community leaders. Admittedly, I still have slip ups when I am having a bad day. But my awareness is there and the power of saying the words “I am sorry” when I slip up, cannot be understated, as demonstrated in my story.
How do you define “Leadership”? Can you explain what you mean or give an example?
Leadership is not a technical endeavor. It is about harnessing your soft skills to lead, inspire, and support others to become leaders themselves in support of the mission. It is easy to spot leaders in our lives because we naturally gravitate towards them. We feel moved by their words and actions, and in turn, feel called to act.
Story — Famous leaders who have inspired me include Brene Brown, Simon Sinek, Mike Rowe, Barack and Michelle Obama, and Pete Buttigieg. At a more personal level, I have been inspired and called to act by my friend Zack. Zack is from the Middle East, immigrated to Boston, and later moved to New Hampshire. He is a traveler and a writer. These are some of the many things we have in common. But it is his work as a humanitarian and development specialist that moves me. Zack spearheads projects across the Middle East — a region that is near and dear to me because of the years I spent in the region. His commitment to helping others is notable and his ability to write beautifully about it inspires many to act/give. In the last five years, I have donated to many of his projects. More recently, I have helped him move projects forward with my professional writing skills and connections to other nonprofits that can help. I will continue to support his work because his leadership continues to inspire me.
Throughout my career, I have worked for many in leadership positions, many of whom were in the role because of their technical skills, as opposed to their leadership skills (per my definition). Over time, this gap in leadership skills showed to be problematic for those of us who relied on leadership to guide, support, and inspire us to believe in, be excited about, and fulfill the mission. A gap in leadership only results in frustrated employees and low morale. I have been in that place more than once.
Ok, thank you for all that. Now let’s move to the main focus of our interview. The polarization in our country has become so extreme that families have been torn apart. Erstwhile close friends have not spoken to each other because of strong partisan differences. This is likely a huge topic, but briefly, can you share your view on how this evolved to the boiling point that it’s at now?
Though partisan differences have existed for time eternal, I believe that the internet, social media, and the 24/7 cable news channels helped bring this to the boiling point we have today. But I would like to focus on social media. Undoubtedly, social media has helped us get connected to others in very positive ways. But after a solid decade of use, I now believe social media has more downsides than upsides. Primarily because social media has stopped us from seeing and interacting with each other as fellow human beings. In addition, social media has become a place where people vent their emotions about political issues, which has proven to be a completely unproductive effort, as demonstrated by our hyper-polarized society.
I have no pretensions about bridging the divide between politicians, or between partisan media outlets. But I’d love to discuss the divide that is occurring between families, co workers, and friends. Do you feel comfortable sharing a story from your experience about how family or friends have become a bit alienated because of the partisan atmosphere?
I am happy to say that my family relationships and friendships have not been affected by the partisan atmosphere. That is purely by choice. That choice being to see everyone in my life as human beings, as opposed to political beings. And because of this approach, I am treated as such in return.
What does this mean in practice? When I relate to my friends and family, I focus on our everyday lives. In other words, we are relating about the human condition. On that basis, it is easy to have and maintain healthy, positive relationships that can lead to the kind of trust and dialogue needed to reverse the partisan divide we have with our families and friends.
As Surgeon General Dr. Vivek Murthy said recently, “relationship is the foundation of dialogue.” It is time we start forming and re-forming relationships with those around us, no matter what their politics, and remember that, no matter how cliché this is, “we are in this together”. It is simply the truth. With the challenges we face today nationally and internationally, coming together to solve problems is ever more critical to our future.
In your opinion, what can be done to bridge the divide that has occurred in families? Can you please share a story or example?
I have ideas but cannot say I have all the answers for bridging the divide. The climate is so toxic and until there is a reckoning with social media, the internet, and our source of news (Fox vs. CNN, etc.), I believe we can only progress in baby steps. And that first baby step is to start finding common ground by seeing each other as human beings. That means, dropping political labels, forgetting who we each voted for, and simply getting back to basics — remembering that we are all human beings with the same basic hopes and dreams for our lives.
Story — I do not believe we have to agree on our politics to have positive relationships. We must simply choose to not let politics define our relationships. For me, maintaining family relationships is more important than our politics (consider that I am the only left-leaning person in my immediate family). Politics is not the only interesting thing to talk about over dinner with our family and friends. And if it is the only thing you can find to talk about, you are surely missing out on a world full of interesting things both big and small. When I am with my parents, I focus on the things we share like travel, arts/culture, gardening, cooking/food, and updates on our relatives and family friends. With my sister, we share a love of cooking, wellness, dogs, and family. This works and keeps our relationships happy and healthy.
How about the workplace, what can be done to bridge the partisan divide that has fractured relationships there? Can you please share a story or example?
Luckily, in my places of work, we do not bring politics or our political identities to the table. We focus on team and on delivery of the best quality work. In other words, we treat each other as human beings living through and experiencing the human condition. We understand the adventure of life and that we depend on each other to survive and thrive.
Story — I felt this reality intensely when I visited a remote project site for two weeks — a tiny 2.5 square mile island in the middle of the Pacific Ocean — Wake Island. I knew I was surrounded by not just politically opposite people, but people whose life stories were much different than mine. But we never let our differences define our day-to-day which was always about helping each other survive and thrive on this remote island. We focused on fun and camaraderie because we had to, to stay happy and healthy while living on a 2.5 square-mile remote island with 100 people from whom you cannot hide. I remain good friends with the guys who hosted me for two weeks. Our politics do not divide us. Our commitment to camaraderie unites us.
I think one of the causes of our divide comes from the fact that many of us see a political affiliation as the primary way to self identify. But of course there are many other ways to self identify. What do you think can be done to address this?
Putting aside that addressing this comes down to the personal will to change, here is an idea: to find ways for people of different views to interact on a personal level as human beings, instead of political beings. If together we could engage in activities that encourage dialogue about our daily lives, versus our votes or political views, we might just remember the most basic truth — that we are human beings before we are anything else, and share the same basic desires for our lives — to work and to play, to love our friends and family, be healthy, to live with purpose, etc.
Story — This is how I look at it: my concern with people I know or meet, is not how we voted or to which party we belong. Character is what matters to me, and how that person treats me and those around me. This approach has always worked for me. Though it is easy for us to categorize and stereotype people based on their vote or political party, interacting with others on a personal level about everyday life has shown me otherwise — that people’s identities are not defined by their politics.
At the risk of oversimplifying, here is one anecdote that stands as small proof that people are not defined by their votes. Over Labor Day weekend 2020, I vacationed in rural Michigan in the heart of a Trump loving community. Note that I am a brown-skinned female and child of legal immigrants. As I went about town, there was a small part of me that wondered if I would get “attacked” in some way given the climate of hate in which we now live. But as I walked towards the door of a convenient store at the gas station, a local gentleman opened the door for me with a big friendly smile. I returned a big smile and thanked him for his kindness. I cannot prove anything about his politics, but chances were pretty good given where I was (Trump signs were prolific). I left confirming my belief in humanity — that we are not defined by our votes and that kindness is possible between all human beings despite our politics.
Apart from this anecdote, I know my premise to be true personally because my everyday life is filled with the politically opposite and my relationships are just fine. My genuine affection for them is possible and vice versa because our common humanity, not our politics, defines our relationship.
Much ink has been spilled about how social media companies and partisan media companies continue to make money off creating a split in our society. Sadly the cat is out of the bag and at least in the near term there is no turning back. Social media and partisan media have a vested interest in maintaining the divide, but as individuals none of us benefit by continuing this conflict. What can we do moving forward to not let social media divide us?
Things we can do include choosing to do the following:
- Unfollow the friends who consistently post about politics on their social media (but do not unfriend them)
- Stop using social media to vent your political frustrations
- Stop using social media to convince others of your point of view. IT DOES NOT WORK.
- Live less online and more in real life
What can we do moving forward to not let partisan media pundits divide us?
I appreciate the question, but not letting partisan media pundits divide us is a choice. But it is difficult to make that choice if you are not aware of how partisan media pundits play on our emotions, and how your emotions affect your actions/behavior.
In general, it seems to me that the actions, decisions, and behavior of a large swath of our society are driven primarily by emotions. This is impulsive living, which absolutely feeds the divisive and emotionally charged society we live in today. We need to live thoughtfully again (if we ever once did).
Sadly we have reached a fevered pitch where it seems that the greatest existential catastrophe that can happen to our country is that “the other side” seizes power. We tend to lose sight of the fact that as a society and as a planet we face more immediate dangers. What can we do to lower the ante a bit and not make every small election cycle a battle for the “very existence of our country”?
Because we did not arrive at this place in our politics overnight, realistically, changing course on this issue is more of a long-term holistic strategy that addresses the structure of our government and two-party system (we need a multi-party system if we are serious about stopping the battle for the soul of our country); civics education throughout K-12 that includes negotiation, debate, conflict resolution, and media literacy; implementing a national service program that ensures collaboration and engagement across political views; and for our political representatives to hold monthly town halls across the nation that encourage dialogue and interaction.
Seeing every small election cycle as a battle for the existence of our country, might be referred to as “overdoing democracy” as coined by author and philosopher, Robert Talisse. What this means is we have lost perspective to the point of undermining the very principles we purport to believe in and be “fighting for”.
The reality is that democracy and life in general, are about finding balance across differing ideas. Every day most of us negotiate and compromise with those around us — at home, in the workplace, with our friends. It should not be different when it comes to politics. Which begs the question — why do we drop our scruples, discretion, and restraint when it comes to politics?
Ok wonderful. Here is the main question of our interview. Can you please share your “5 Steps That Each Of Us Can Take To Proactively Help Heal Our Country”. Kindly share a story or example for each.
1.) Engage with each other as human beings, instead of political beings. Politics is important. But politics will never define my relationships. My personal version of “country over party” is “relationships over politics”.
Story — My friend Mike is a retired firefighter, security contractor, landscaper, now in industrial sales. We have been friends for 10 years. We met in the bar of a contractor camp in Kabul, Afghanistan, and shared stateside contact information. We were both headed home within days. We kept in touch because he lives near my parents, making it easy to reconnect. And that we did, establishing a most unlikely friendship. I mean, what could we possibly have in common when on the surface, we are total opposites in ways that really ruffle feathers these days? That we are politically opposite, says it all, given the political climate we have had for at least a decade or more.
But our politics has never mattered. Since meeting, Mike has become one of my closest friends. We have each gone through some real tough times and have been nothing but a rock of support for each other. He is one of the most respectful people I know and a great listener. He gets people in a way I have not seen others “get people”. And despite our political differences, we get along because we appreciate each other as human beings (not political beings), with our respective thoughts, experiences, opinions. He has never judged, made fun of, nor disrespected who I am and my values, nor I of him, no matter how opposite we are on stuff that gets most people riled up.
Wouldn’t it be nice if we could each find a way to relate as human beings, rather than political beings? Radio host Krista Tippett said that “this moment we’re in is not just a social crisis and not just a political crisis. It’s a spiritual crisis.” — referring to the human condition. I agree. It just seems that we have forgotten who and what we are at basic — human beings. Our divided world makes me sad. But my unlikely friendship with Mike and others who are my opposite give me hope for better times in this world and I am ever grateful for human beings like Mike.
2.) Accept instead of getting angry and upset with others because of who we voted for.
Story — When my friend Mike and I talk, it is rarely about politics. But when the topic does arise, I simply listen to what he has to say and choose to not to be triggered by his political thoughts and opinions. I do not try to change him, nor convince him of my point of view, nor riddle him with facts. I simply listen. And sometimes I share what I think, and he listens in return.
While debate can be healthy, I choose not to debate him (or others) on the issues because I know I cannot change his mind unless I have a personal story that proves my point; a story, that per chance, might resonate with him because we have a caring friendship. Recall the adage that change comes from within. And that people are moved to change when something is or becomes personal to them.
So instead of trying to prove our points or to change people’s minds, how about we reallocate that energy into forming positive relationships? It would go a long way in reducing the divisiveness, hatred, and anger that pervade our society today, and allow us to be a more productive democracy.
3.) Engage in person rather than on social media which changes absolutely no one’s minds.
I cannot think of one instance in which I saw someone or learned of someone who changed his/her mind after a 200+ comment thread on a Facebook post. Furthermore, social media and the digital world have led us to dehumanize the people with whom we interact. To attack our family and friends with words we would never say in person.
The answer is, stick to cute posts of our pets, family photos, and vacations. And start reengaging with people in real life instead of online. Reject digital relations and return to human relations. And perhaps, we might just lessen the hate and the divide, and get back to remembering what we all “learned in Kindergarten”.
Story — Facebook blossomed during the Obama administration. As a new user, I occasionally posted political things on my page and/or responded to what my friends posted. It did not take long for me to see the ugliness of the comment threads and how demoralized I felt about humanity. In one instance, I became the target of people’s ire when the local newspaper interviewed me about a hot local topic and posted the article on their Facebook page. I saw firsthand how inaccurately people read news articles and the assumptions they make when they see a photo. I was being attacked for things that were not at all true about me.
So, I stopped posting political things on my page and stopped reading the political posts of my friends, many of whom I keep in touch with outside of Facebook, where life really matters. Taking this approach has kept my relationships intact and makes me remember that our politics do not define us nor our ability to love and care for one another and work together.
4.) Start understanding that our most BASIC wants and desires as human beings are the same despite our votes.
It does not take much to understand that as human beings, we all have the same basic desires. All you have to do is talk to others about everyday life. Across my relationships, we share our daily struggles and our triumphs. We lift each other up when we are down. We celebrate the things that make us happy. I say this as a brown-skinned child of immigrants from a developing country whose daily life is filled with both conservatives and liberals who get along with each other because our common humanity defines our relationships. It is that simple. But it is a choice. A choice we each have control over.
Story — In my line of work, especially when I am on a construction jobsite photographing the field team, I encounter people — mostly men, with backgrounds very different than mine. I am hyper-aware of this given what I do for work (marketing and communications), who I report to (the President), as well as the color of my skin, my gender, and my life story. My awareness of these differences makes me work harder at building relationships. In the first place, having the relationship is crucial for the kind of work I do. And secondly, I simply want to prove once again, that it is possible to get along and have positive relationships with all walks of life.
Most recently, on a jobsite, I found myself intrigued with one fellow who had come out of retirement to do the project. He was key to project success, so I had to talk to him anyway. Sporting a long scraggly, graying beard, he often sat pensively, with a cigarette in one hand and either a coffee or Dr. Pepper in the other. His voice was deep and scratchy, his words spoken with a notable Texas accent. He was a superstar in the trades — mechanic, electrician, welder, and more. He also owned a large ranch in western Texas for most of his life. There could not have been more things different about the two of us — at least on the surface.
To get my job done, it is on me to make the effort at building a relationship. Luckily, my number one strength is learning. Being curious and asking questions is my jam. And as revealed in the book, How to Win Friends and Influence People, being curious and a good listener are what it takes to open the door and build trust.
The first thing this fellow told me was in response to my question about his retirement a few years back. He said ““well, my wife took care of me all my years working, and it was time for me to stop and take care of her for the rest of our lives. I am 69 and we’ve been together since 7th grade…she’s the ONLY woman I’ve ever been with.” Whoa. I was completely blown away by the humanity of his story, which just made it more compelling to learn more about him.
We talked a lot about the teamwork needed to have a successful project. I learned that singing is his passion and that he performs every weekend back home in Texas bars. We talked about our love of music, how it fills our souls and can change our moods in an instant. I even let him coax me into singing karaoke one night after work and let that be a way to connect. Lastly, I learned that we had both worked on Wake Island Airfield (one of the most remote Air Force installations in the world), and that he had traveled quite a bit in Southeast Asia like I have.
In short, the more I dug, the more I realized that we had much in common. By the end of three weeks on the jobsite, I felt a kinship with this fellow. Once again, I had proved that despite perceived differences, we are all the same, if only we are willing to open our minds and hearts enough to see that reality. Throughout my travels overseas as a kid and into adulthood, I have had many experiences that showed me the same. I shared many of those stories in my Creative Mornings talk. It takes very little effort to see the humanity in everyone around us.
5.) Realize that politics should not define or consume every aspect of our lives. If you are spending all your time posting about national politics on social media, it is time to ask yourself if this is really making a difference in the world. If you are losing friends and family over politics, it is time to stop and ask yourself — is this worth it? If everything you see, hear, and speak has a political frame around it, it is time to stop, take a deep breath, and evaluate. Philosopher and author, Robert Talisse, refers to this as “overdoing democracy”. And the reality is that overdoing anything makes us lose perspective, reason, and balance, as just described.
Story — I think we commonly agree that it is very difficult and even painful to be privy to the political frustrations and anger of our friends and family, as spewed online in their social media. We do not want to believe that those close to us could have such different beliefs and worldviews. Many people have chosen to “unfriend” people online and even in real life, whereas, I have decidedly not done that — first, because the relationships I have are important to me. Second, unfriending people because of their votes is unrealistic considering how many people in my daily life are my political opposite including my immediate family and countless people at work. Third, somewhere along the way I realized that living in an echo chamber is not interesting nor good for me, my relationships, my community, and the country and world at large. It is simply not realistic to limit ourselves to only the people who share our views.
Let’s remember that living together and peacefully in a society comprised of differing ideas is at the heart of a functioning democracy. Let’s stop making politics the center of our lives which has shown to be destructive to our families, communities, and our country.
Simply put, is there anything else we can do to ‘just be nicer to each other’?
Choose kindness and relate to each other as fellow human beings that experience the same daily struggles and triumphs that life presents us. There is no truth greater than this.
We are going through a rough period now. Are you optimistic that this issue can eventually be resolved? Can you explain?
Though ~70 million Americans do not agree with this, I am optimistic about having a new President who embodies the words compassion, dignity, and respect — qualities that we direly need to see in the highest office again. That is a start. But I do not think that the whole of our problems will be resolved in any short order. I believe it will take years, maybe even a decade, to reverse the course we are on. I say this because the situation is multi-faceted and developed over the course of more than a decade.
Moreover, the reality is we will never fully rid our country or the world for that matter, of hate, racism, and bigotry. The trick is getting back to compromise when it comes to politics — something we practice every day in our personal and professional lives but have somehow inexplicably excused from our political lives. We might just get there if we start by dropping our political identities and start relating to each other through the lens of our common humanity.
If you could tell young people one thing about why they should consider making a positive impact on our society, like you, what would you tell them?
When you engage in making a positive impact, you have a much greater understanding of the complexity of democracy and governing; how difficult it is to pass policy or implement a public project. You will be more empathetic to those who choose to dedicate their lives to service in government and it will change how you relate and respond to those in government. You will also learn how to become more effective at making an impact. Lastly, living democracy gives us purpose and ensures that we never take our democracy for granted.
Is there a person in the world, or in the US, with whom you would like to have a private breakfast or lunch, and why? He or she might just see this, especially if we tag them. 🙂
Barack Obama. He consistently demonstrated the qualities of good leadership, and remained cool, fun, young at heart, relatable, and inspiring throughout his tenure. I respect him greatly for the grace he exuded as POTUS. Moreover, I feel a bit of kinship with Obama because he is also a third culture kid. Finally, he is an excellent writer and orator which are traits I aspire to. I continue to be inspired by his thoughtful leadership today.
How can our readers follow you online?
- Instagram: Karina_living_life
- LinkedIn: Karina Quintans
- Creative Mornings talk
- https://jebelworks.com/
- Medium: Karina Quintans (I am hoping to build a blog on Medium focused on finding humanity in everyday life and to establish a website for my photography.)
This was very meaningful, and thank you so much for the time you spent on this interview. We wish you only continued success on your great work!
Putting The United Back Into The United States: Karina Quintans of JebelWorks On The 5 Things That… was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.