An Interview With Cynthia Corsetti
The practice of cognitive empathy invites us to gain a deeper understanding of human-to-human and team dynamics and to more effectively mediate conflict in the workplace. Sometimes when you see two team members in conflict with each other, it’s tempting to say, “Hey guys, stop it! Duke it out on your own time!” However, conflict left unchecked tends to simmer or escalate, and it’s not HR’s problem to solve, it’s yours.
Empathy, the ability to understand and share the feelings of another, is increasingly recognized as a pivotal leadership trait. In an ever-evolving business landscape, leaders who exhibit genuine empathy are better equipped to connect, inspire, and drive their teams towards success. But how exactly does empathy shape leadership dynamics? How can it be harnessed to foster stronger relationships, improved decision-making, and a more inclusive work environment? As part of this series, we had the pleasure of interviewing Laura S. Scott.
Laura S. Scott is an Executive Coach, Author, and Speaker and the Founder and President of 180 Coaching, based in Tampa, Florida. Laura’s keen interest in neuroscience, brain-based mindfulness, and emotional self-regulation has prompted her to create tools and techniques to support resiliency and equanimity, including her Pause (II) Power training program for resiliency and emotional self-mastery and the Scott Model for Cognitive Empathy.
Thank you so much for joining us in this interview series. Before we dive into our discussion about empathy, our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you share with us the backstory about what brought you to your specific career path?
When I was six or seven years old, I wanted to be a teacher. My first students were my stuffed animals. Then at fifteen, I fell in love with fashion and that became my first career and my first business as an entrepreneur. I have always loved writing and the visual arts, and when the opportunity presented itself, I moved into publishing, which I loved!
When my husband and I decided to move to the USA so he could accept a promotion, I sold that business and decided to press the reset button and see what else I could do. I fell into coaching when a guy who owned a management consulting business was looking for someone to coach his clients. I told him I didn’t know what coaches do, and he asked me to do a series of assessments and I guess I fit the profile.
Back then, coaching was all about productivity and performance and though I felt I was helping clients feel successful and accomplished, I could see there were underlying blocks to achievement that went beyond business skills and behaviors. It was more about the mindset, emotional resiliency, belief systems, and the ability to trust and be trustworthy in the world. I went back to coach school to find out how I could coach at this core level and help my clients be the strong, confident leaders they aspired to be. I called my company 180 Coaching because I understood that change is possible only when you change what you think is possible.
Can you share the most interesting story that happened to you since you started your career?
One of the toughest times in my life was when I made the decision to divorce just before my 50th birthday. I had been married for 23 years, but it was the right choice for me and my husband. I essentially started from scratch with a new business, in a new city, where I didn’t know anyone. Yet, I was surprised by how liberated I felt, knowing that I could reinvent myself. I realized that I was the captain of my own ship, and it was up to me alone to chart the course.
I was working on building my coaching practice and I decided to coach myself through the tough times. When things became challenging for me, I asked myself my favorite coaching question: “Who do you want to be through this?”
This question gave me permission to craft the most authentic response to whatever was happening based on my ideal of how I wanted to show up in the world. I didn’t have a lot of role models for this ideal, so I just tried to live my values, and soon I was earning the trust of my clients. They knew, and I knew, I wasn’t trying to be anything else but the best version of myself. It wasn’t always perfect, but it was me.
What do you think makes your company stand out? Can you share a story?
When I talk about the type of coaching and training I do, I say, “I don’t do cookie-cutter.” I love to customize for the client’s needs, and I am good at reading a room. If I am facilitating a strategic planning meeting with a team of executives, and I see an opportunity to give a great idea some oxygen, I will veer off the agenda and ask the group if they want to explore it. Inevitably, what happens next is way more exciting and empowering than anything we could have planned for.
When I plan for off sites or speaking engagements, I look for ways to be playful, and add some humor so we can all laugh at ourselves. I remember the time a brought an iguana puppet to a presentation I did in Brazil. The Iguana warmed up the crowd for me. Sometimes I will stick a random funny animal picture in the middle of one of my slide decks, just to get people laughing.
You are a successful business leader. Which three character traits do you think were most instrumental to your success? Can you please share a story or example for each?
My genuine, and relentless, curiosity and my love of learning are two traits that I think make me a successful coach, speaker, and a leadership and resiliency trainer. Leadership implies a desire to look forward into the unknown for answers and solutions. I love doing that. When my clients were asking me how they could be more empathetic in the workplace, there were few resources I could point them to, so I created my own tool for cognitive empathy. It took a lot of research, trial and error, but it’s something my clients appreciate because I found a way to simplify it and make it applicable to day-to-day practice.
The third most important trait I attribute to my success is my ability to challenge assumptions and suspend judgment. People who are quick to judge or make assumptions (most of which turn out to be false), are unintentionally narrowing their options and their perspective significantly, and that narrowing limits their opportunities and their ability to engage others for the greater good.
Leadership often entails making difficult decisions or hard choices between two apparently good paths. Can you share a story with us about a hard decision or choice you had to make as a leader? I’m curious to understand how these challenges have shaped your leadership.
My clients will tell you that I don’t believe in mistakes. I always reassure my clients that there are no mistakes, only course corrections. Whether you are on a sailboat, on a golf course, or in college, in the middle of your course of study, any “bad” decisions can be corrected. Once we decide we are going in the wrong direction, we can change course, in the middle of a race, in the middle of a sand trap, and in the middle of a semester. I have changed careers three times and I am sure there is another career, or two, in front of me. I trust that I made each decision at the right time, with the best information I had, and with the best of intentions. I can’t ask more of myself and others.
Hard decisions are only hard because you have competing choices, or the perception of no choice, and the outcome is uncertain or unknown. Making the choice sets it in motion, and only then can you see where that decision is taking you. If you don’t like where you are headed, you have the power to change it or make it work for you. Maybe not today, but someday there will be an exit ramp or a fork in the road that you can choose to take yourself, or your business, in a different direction.
Ok, thank you for that. Let’s now jump to the primary focus of our interview. Let’s begin with a basic definition so that all of us are on the same page. How do you define empathy in a leadership context, and why do you believe it’s a vital trait for leaders to possess in today’s work environment?
Empathy is simply understanding and appreciating another’s feelings or perspectives. We all perceive things differently based on our experiences, biases, and belief systems. Leaders who don’t seek to understand the feelings, fears, biases, and perspectives of the people around them are operating in a vacuum where they incorrectly assume that everyone perceives and interprets things, people, and situations the exact way they do.
A leader who lacks empathy is embarking on a solo venture into the unknown, without guides, maps, language, and a way to manage risks, and if this leader successfully reaches their desired destination, there is a chance there will be no one to celebrate it with.
Can you share a personal experience where showing empathy as a leader significantly impacted a situation or relationship in your organization?
I have been in a few situations where something tragic has happened and there is no quick fix. My role as a “leader” in these situations is not to solve anything but to hold space for whatever emotions need to be expressed, including mine. Last year, I was making a presentation, and I was expecting to share the stage with a leader of a non-profit, a woman I had previously met and admired greatly. The person who had invited me to present pulled me aside and told me that one of the board members of the non-profit organization had just arrived and he would be taking her place as she had passed away the day before.
I was trying to hold back tears as I welcomed him to join me, and I was speechless. I simply said, “I am sorry, I have no words…” and then gave him the mic. He turned to the audience and expressed his shock and his grief at his leader’s passing, and made a brief pitch for the organization, apologizing because he was “a poor substitute” for her and passed the mic back to me. I could see the audience needed some time to process this news, and I prompted some people who knew this woman to say a few words. When the presentation ended, I overheard a woman who had spoken about the deceased leader say to the board member, “You didn’t have to apologize, you showed up! Just like she did all those years!”
I share this story because empathy can be expressed in so many ways: saying nothing, having no words, or maybe just saying a few words with an apology, or standing up and saying to someone, “Your presence here is enough.”
How do empathetic leaders strike a balance between understanding their team’s feelings and making tough decisions that might not be universally popular?
Acknowledging that some decisions may be unpopular, or difficult to make, is the first step. If leaders don’t express how hard it was for them, or exactly what had to be weighed, or risked, in making the decision, some team members may assume the decision was made casually, without thought or consideration for others. There has to be some sharing around the larger goal, or long-term strategy, some sharing around why this decision had to me made.
Shared pain, or shared concerns, sometimes help to bring people together. Shining a spotlight on a fear, or the proverbial elephant in the room, can help people to appreciate how much thought has gone into the decision making. A leader can say, “There will be some rough going in the short term, but I have confidence we can overcome the obstacles. I have heard concerns that the new operating hours might cause some burdens for those with childcare or elder care arrangements. Just know that we are working with our operational leads to build some flexibility into our scheduling going forward.”
When people fear change, they have a hard time feeling optimistic about the future. A leader can express excitement or optimism as long as it is truly genuine. You just can’t fake optimism. You can be genuinely optimistic if you trust the team and yourself to navigate through the uncertainties. If you don’t have that trust in yourself and others, you may want to consider delaying the decision until you do.
How would you differentiate between empathy and sympathy in leadership? Why is it important for leaders to distinguish between the two?
Even professional writers sometime struggle to differentiate between sympathy and empathy, which is why the Mirriam-Webster Grammar resource offers this tip: “In general, sympathy is when you share the feelings of another; empathy is when you understand the feelings of another but do not necessarily share them.”
Empathy from leaders is almost always appreciated, whereas sympathy is not always appropriate, timely, or appreciated. Imagine telling your boss that you are getting a divorce, and him, or her, responding, “Oh, I feel so sorry for you. My divorce was hell. It’s hard when someone says they don’t love you anymore.” Sympathy is often responding to someone else’s emotions through the filter of your own emotions or lived experience. If you are reliving your pain around divorce, and feeling pity or sorrow for them, as you reflect how divorce made YOU feel, that’s sympathy, that’s YOUR experience of divorce, not necessarily THEIR experience at the moment. You may then feel the distress that you imagine they are feeling, and in your moment of distress, you may not be in the best state of mind to be helpful.
Expressing empathy is typically done through asking a question. It’s a sincere desire to know how you can assist, or get out of the way, or give them the space they need to process or heal. It’s an acknowledgement that you don’t know exactly how they feel, or how to help, but you are there for them. In the divorce scenario, empathy says: “I understand you are facing some challenging times ahead. Please let me know how I can assist you? Are there things I can do, or not do, that will help you navigate this difficult time?”
What are some practical strategies or exercises that leaders can employ to cultivate and enhance their empathetic skills?
Empathy is an exercise in curiosity and humility, coming from an acknowledgement of you not knowing, or fully understanding, how a person may be feeling or thinking in the moment.
Make a practice of catching yourself making assumptions about what might be going on in the mind of someone else. Instead, just say to yourself, “I don’t know what the person is experiencing right now, but if I create a safe space for them to share, maybe they will let me know how I can help.”
Creating safe spaces for people to share is key. Don’t unexpectantly call someone out in a team meeting and say, “How are you feeling about this, George?” That’s putting someone on the spot. Instead, wait until you have a quiet, private moment with that person. Ask them to go for a walk with you to get a coffee, wait until you are travelling together, book a confidential 1:1 meeting with them, or create a confidential survey to send to the team.
How can empathy help leaders navigate the complexities of leading diverse teams and ensure inclusivity?
Empathy is a great way to fully understand the cultural differences in how people communicate, make choices, or perceive situations. When I facilitate off sites, I like to do one or two exercises that will allow us to see and appreciate the differences. People love discovering new and interesting things about their teammates. The trick is to suspend judgement when people share something that might be odd or distasteful to you, and refrain from teasing them later about something they shared. I remember a trip to Thailand when one of my Thai guides shared with me that his favorite street food was fried grasshoppers. He laughed when I made a face but I didn’t shame him. Instead I asked, “What do you like about them?” He replied, “They are crispy and spicy, and go well with beer, like potato chips!” His description didn’t convince me to give them a try, but I understood why he would like them. Empathy is all about furthering your understanding, not about influencing others to come around to your way of thinking.
Inclusivity and empathy go hand in hand. When you can understand and appreciate the perspectives and feelings of others, you begin to think about how you can expand your circle and include them in your tribe. Humans are instinctively tribal. We appreciate there is safety in numbers, so we look for common ground in those around us. I prefer potato chips and my Thai guide prefers fried grasshoppers, but we both love spicy, crispy food paired with a beer!
What’s your approach to ensuring that succession planning is a holistic process, and not just confined to the top layers of management? How do you communicate this philosophy through the organization?
As a leader, if you can be a role model for empathy, that will go a long way. You can also positively reinforce empathetic behavior and language when you see it throughout the organization. Building empathy into your brand or messaging at an organization level is good too, but only if you and your team are incentivized to walk the talk.
Based on your experience and research, can you please share “5 Ways Empathy Will Affect Your Leadership”?
1. Seeking out the perspectives of others will reveal information and nuances the hard data may not show, making you a more informed and confident decision maker. Many leaders have told me a version of, “The data says this, but my gut tells me that.” What if you interviewed your teammates and did a gut check with them, too? Would that help? Cognitive empathy invites you to take a pause and move away from the hard data and take a temperature read around the feelings of others.
I am a fan of true crime and love documentaries of so-called “cold cases,” when a detective dusts off a box of old evidence and notes, and decides to take a fresh look at an unsolved murder and re-interview potential witnesses or family members. Detectives usually revisit these cold cases because they have a gut feeling that something was missed or overlooked during the initial investigation. That hunch is usually confirmed when the detective re-interviews witnesses and new information comes to light. Likewise, leaders rarely know what they don’t know. Empathy is often just playing detective: asking the “dumb” questions, listening, and taking notes.
2. Being more empathetic to other’s concerns, feelings, and their values helps you build trust. If people feel that you have heard them out and understand their concerns, they will be more trusting and supportive of you as a leader. Empathetic conversations also give us an opportunity to share the values we are trying to honor through our decision-making. Your team might not always agree with all your decisions, but if you share with them the values you are seeking to honor, they will understand why you make the choices you made.
Empathy is seeking to understand how you can earn the trust of others and be trustworthy, even to yourself. Often that means having values conversations with your team and walking the values talk.
3 . Empathy can make you a more effective influencer and change agent. Exercising your natural curiosity about how your team members are feeling and how they are perceiving situations can reveal gaps of knowledge and understanding between organizational hierarchies, and potential pockets of resistance. Taking opportunities to share vital information, socialize ideas, communicate the whys, or long-term strategies with the goal of closing those gaps is vital to influencing and facilitating change. Closing information and perception gaps using cognitive empathy helps to reduce resistance and friction down the road.
Influencing is not always a top-down communication. My VP and Director clients sometimes feel the need to intervene when they see their CEOs and COOs about to make a misstep. They build strong allies and trusting relationships with others in the senior leadership team by “managing up” when necessary, with the intention of helping that leader succeed.
4 . The practice of cognitive empathy invites us to gain a deeper understanding of human-to-human and team dynamics and to more effectively mediate conflict in the workplace. Sometimes when you see two team members in conflict with each other, it’s tempting to say, “Hey guys, stop it! Duke it out on your own time!” However, conflict left unchecked tends to simmer or escalate, and it’s not HR’s problem to solve, it’s yours.
If you can facilitate a private conversation with both of the parties in a safe space where they can each have uninterrupted time to air their concerns or grievances with each other, it can go a long way to de-escalate a conflict. You don’t have to play referee, you just have to ask a few questions:
I noticed you two are having issues with each other related to the adoption of this new process. What’s troubling you? Or,
I noticed the two of you are not working together that same way you used to, what has changed?
As facilitator of this conversation, you may have to set some ground rules like, “Don’t interrupt the other person while they are speaking.” Or, “Please start with how you are feeling right now?” If you don’t feel comfortable being the facilitator or this conversation or you don’t trust yourself not to take sides, then find a professional mediator, or someone else in your organization to facilitate. Cognitive empathy in conflict is not about negotiating a truce, it is more about exposing the underlying issues and inviting each of the players to tap into their own expression of empathy for each other.
5 . Empathy invites you to challenge your assumptions about what is true and what is possible. Executive coaches understand that unchallenged assumptions are one of the major blocks to success for many leaders, so we feel duty-bound to point out an assumption when we see it. I was having a succession planning conversation with a client, when he said, in reference to a potential candidate for VP of Operations, “She doesn’t care about titles. She’s not hungry enough.” I joked that his employees are pretty well paid and no one in his company was at risk of actually starving, so what is she hungry for? He thought for a moment, and said, “I honestly don’t know. I guess I should ask her…”
We make a bunch of assumptions about a lot of things. We make assumptions about what motivates people, why people resist good ideas, what people really want out of their lives, and what people really care about. Most of us are not mind-readers. We can’t be expected to know all these things about everyone on our team, but what if we did? Would that help?
If we truly understood what our teammates really cared about, what they were anxious about, what they really wanted, would we be a better leader? I think so. The best thing about cognitive empathy is that it costs nothing but some time. All we have to do is take the time to ask.
Are there potential pitfalls or challenges associated with being an empathetic leader? How can these be addressed?
Don’t use empathy to excuse bad or unacceptable behavior. Empathy can only thrive in safe spaces, and if a person’s words or behavior is making their teammates feel unsafe, you must address it immediately.
There is a risk that the empathetic leader may be perceived to be slow to make decisions. Some decisions really do need to be made immediately, without taking the time to consider all those who might be impacted, but in those cases the leader should take full responsibility if the decision later backfires. Again, there are no mistakes, only course corrections. Monitoring the impact of your decision through an empathetic feedback loop will allow you to pivot with confidence, knowing your team will back you when you do course correct.
Off-topic, but I’m curious. As someone steering the ship, what thoughts or concerns often keep you awake at night? How do those thoughts influence your daily decision-making process?
I am most troubled when I have to exclude people because there is not an option to expand the “invite list.”
I have to think hard about why I want certain people onboard: What is their value-add? Am I setting them up to succeed in this environment? Are they going to have fun? Are they going to enjoy the people they are with?
You are a person of great influence. If you could start a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. 🙂
I am passionate about emotional resiliency, and I believe, through focus and practice, we can rewire our brains for resiliency and equanimity. We are no longer vulnerable cave-dwellers waiting for the tiger to pounce, but our brain sometimes acts as if we are. Differentiating real threats from brain artifacts, or click bait, is the key. We will have to learn to look past the pervasive fear mongering in our media outlets and hold back from clicking on the video or link. We will have to get better at separating fact from fiction because our old horror stories no longer serve us.
How can our readers further follow you online?
I have narrowed my social media focus to LinkedIn and Instagram. I also post my webinars and speaking engagements on the About page or the Pause (II) Power Page of my website.
Thank you for the time you spent sharing these fantastic insights. We wish you only continued success in your great work!
About the Interviewer: Cynthia Corsetti is an esteemed executive coach with over two decades in corporate leadership and 11 years in executive coaching. Author of the upcoming book, “Dark Drivers,” she guides high-performing professionals and Fortune 500 firms to recognize and manage underlying influences affecting their leadership. Beyond individual coaching, Cynthia offers a 6-month executive transition program and partners with organizations to nurture the next wave of leadership excellence.
Laura S Scott 180 Coaching: 5 Ways Empathy Will Affect Your Leadership was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.