I Can’t Get No Satisfaction: Dagna Bieda Of the Mindful Dev On Why So Many Of Us Are Feeling Unsatisfied & What We Can Do About It
An Interview With Drew Gerber
Meditation helps to stay in touch with the thoughts roaming wild in mind and noticing what comes up internally.
From an objective standpoint, we are living in an unprecedented era of abundance. Yet so many of us are feeling unsatisfied. Why are we seemingly so insatiable? What is going on inside of us that is making us feel unsatisfied? What is the brain chemistry that makes us feel this way? Is our brain wired for endless insatiable consumption? What can we do about it? In this interview series, we are talking to credentialed experts such as psychologists, psychiatrists, therapists, brain science experts, as well as spiritual and religious leaders, and mind-body-spirit coaches, to address why so many of us are feeling unsatisfied & what we can do about it.
As a part of this series, I had the distinct pleasure of interviewing Dagna Bieda from the Mindful Dev.
Dagna Bieda is a Software Engineer turned Career Coach for Engineers. Coding for 10+ years, and coaching for the past 3.5+ years, she moved from programming computers to re-programming human minds. The results her clients have experienced range from a significant reduction in anxiety through getting skip-level promotions to doubling salaries within a couple of months while bringing more fulfillment into her clients’ lives.
Thank you so much for joining us in this interview series! Before we dive in, our readers would love to know how you got from “there to here.” Inspire us with your backstory!
Hi Drew! Thank you so much for having me!
And absolutely — I’d love to share more about how and why I have transitioned into coaching.
Initially, when I started in Software Engineering, I went from a Junior position to a Senior in 2 years and a few months, and I did it so fast, cause I was extremely lucky to be around people who gave me the guidance I needed to grow in an accelerated manner.
They told me exactly what my blindspots were, what gaps I needed to feel, when I needed to switch up my perspective, and provided the kind of feedback that allowed me to grow at such a rapid pace.
That’s what taught me that guidance is key to exponential growth. And as I realized later on in my career, not everybody has such incredible starting conditions to their career in Tech.
However, despite that initial fast growth, I ended up somewhat plateauing at a Senior Engineer level a few years later.
Part of that reason was the fact that I’m an immigrant to the United States. And it took years for me to realize that what I grew up with and considered “standard” behavior, was what was holding me back in that new reality. Specifically — my polish communication style was too direct, and I often came across as an aggressive communicator, even though it was not my intention. But that’s exactly what blocked my career advancement.
Having that cultural disconnect, and realizing in hindsight how my communication was impacting my career felt like a huge AHA moment, and I wanted to share that insight. Mentoring and later on coaching seemed to be the best fit to start helping people out while sharing how I got past my obstacles.
Finally, at the same time when I was somewhat stagnant in my career, I started feeling burnout at work, and I also experienced postpartum depression mixed up with complicated grief after moving across the Atlantic, from Poland to the States.
Therapy not only helped me resolve my past baggage, through labeling and naming the issues I was dealing with, so I could process and let go of my traumas, and rewire my thinking without needing any meds; It also helped me improve my communication skills, I’ve learned how to set healthier boundaries, and work through assumptions I was operating under. And — interestingly, but not surprisingly — all that personal growth showed at work!
Today I use what I learned in therapy and in my personal journey in Tech as an Engineer. I walked my talk, and now I’m passing the wisdom to my coaching clients. And my clients have various backgrounds, and the process works for them as well. In terms of the various backgrounds — they are working at small companies to FAANG+ companies. And their experience ranges from 2–20+ years of experience, and education ranging from self-taught, through career-changing Bootcamp grads, to college grads, some with a military background.
What makes my process work so well, is that it reprograms their minds for success.
What lessons would you share with yourself if you had the opportunity to meet your younger self?
There are 3 specific things I’d absolutely love to share with my younger self:
1. Embrace the journey — there will be a few tough moments in your life, and you’ll grow tremendously from these experiences. You’ll rise like Phoenix from the ashes, and even though in the moment it will feel overwhelming, those experiences will make you who you’re meant to be.
2. Put yourself first — only when you’re needs are met you’ll be able to show up for people you care about as your wholehearted self. It will take some time and practice, but you’ll get there.
3. Seek to understand — there’s a mechanism behind everything that happens. The more you can understand about those mechanisms, the more at ease you’ll be in life. Mastery in life comes from understanding.
None of us are able to experience success without support along the way. Is there a particular person for whom you are grateful because of the support they gave you to grow you from “there to here?” Can you share that story and why you are grateful for them?
My husband. His impact on my life has been mind-blowing, haha. Yea. I think “mind-blowing” is the best phrase to summarize the kind of support and life-changing experiences I’ve been through as a result of us being together.
Our story could fill a book, or inspire a Hollywood movie, but let me make it short and sweet for the readers of this article.
My husband and I met in a hostel while backpacking through Europe, back in 2015. He recently graduated with his Bachelor’s and used up all the money he had saved up for his Master’s to travel for four months across Europe. I keep telling him that was a much better use of that money cause we met towards the end of his travels — in a lovely hostel in Lviv, Ukraine.
Since the day we met, we just vibed. We’re both Engineers, and his pick-up line was: “Do you want to see the robot I built for one of my classes?”, how cheesy! But it worked, hahaha! Later on that evening, we went to a club dancing. He’s Dominican and can move really well, and I love to dance, so we’ve danced through our first date night together while laughing at some nerdy engineering jokes and sharing stories about our families, and just getting to know each other on a very deep and personal level.
After that weekend, I thought I’ll never see him again. It was a fun weekend adventure, but he lived in the States, and back then, I lived in Poland and wasn’t planning on moving. A week later, he took a 15hr train ride from Kyiv to come to Poland and spend some more time with me — our second date. Two weeks after that, he had to finally wrap up his travels and get back to the States for his brother’s wedding. So we met up once more for a date weekend in Paris, where he was flying back from on a buddy pass. Again I thought these were really fun three dates, an awesome summer adventure, but I’ll never see him again.
Yet, we kept in touch… And had really interesting and intellectually stimulating conversations daily, so when he invited me to fly over to visit, I didn’t hesitate and bought tickets right away.
After my very first visit to the States for New Year’s Eve of 2015, where I got to meet (and like!) his family, that I already felt like I knew from all the stories he shared about them… That’s when he finally stole my heart and convinced me to move and try out living on a different continent, where we could be much more successful together and build our future and family on his side of the Atlantic.
I did move, and since then, as a result of our life adventures together, I’ve grown into a completely different, new person. And it’s not just that I moved to a different country. My husband and I went on a 4-month Honeymoon after our wedding in Poland. On that Honeymoon, we visited every single country in South-East Asia, and we started off that journey on the Trans-Siberian train. And nothing expands your mind more than travel. We mostly stayed at hostels, but we also stayed in a Maldives resort for a weekend as a part of that Honeymoon travel, and our bungalow in the water blew my mind cause I never experienced that kind of luxury before.
My husband opened my mind to a completely different kind of living.
Also, being in an intercultural marriage and raising 3-lingual kids together (that speak Polish, Spanish, and English) has been a journey on its own that keeps providing valuable life lessons and growing us as a result.
From day one, when we met, I’ve felt around him so free, and like I could really spread my wings and follow my gut and share my deepest thoughts. I never felt like that around anyone else. The connection we have and the values and priorities we share make us a very strong partnership. I’m incredibly grateful to have my husband in my life and the fact that meeting him, well… turned my life upside down.
Are you working on any exciting new projects now? How do you think it might help people?
Thank you so much for this question, Drew!
Yes, actually, I am working on a book. A book that is very closely related to the core of this interview — lack of satisfaction in life. You see, as a Career Coach for Engineers, I work with Engineers in the Tech Industry, who have incredible opportunities in life and their careers.
Yet, many will, or already do, find themselves stuck in a mid-senior level plateau, where they know they bring value in, yet nobody quite sees or recognizes them for their effort. They get passed on for promotions, opportunities keep slipping through their fingers, and anger and frustration are becoming more apparent in their day to day. What used to be intellectually stimulating a few years before is now boring and makes them feel like a cog in the machine.
These Engineers are on track for burnout. I know, because I’ve been there. Many of my clients have been there. Thankfully, it’s not too late to switch things up or even prevent this stagnation from ever happening!
That’s why I’m writing my book. I want to help Engineers in Tech find more fulfillment in their careers. And help people transitioning into Tech design their career with fulfillment in mind. Because in the Tech Industry, where you can easily make 6 and multiple 6-figures, there are still plenty of people feeling unsatisfied while being materially and financially abundant.
Ok, thank you for sharing your inspired life. Let’s now talk about feeling “unsatisfied”. In the Western world, humans typically have their shelter, food, and survival needs met. What has led to us feeling we aren’t enough and don’t have enough? What is the wiring? Or in other words, how has nature and nurture played into how humans (in an otherwise “safe and secure” environment) experience feeling less than, or a need to have more than what is needed for basic survival?
The reason behind the lack of satisfaction lies in our internal mental programming.
Our minds have been programmed and optimized through millions of years of evolution for survival, not life satisfaction.
That’s where negativity bias, a strong need to belong to a tribe, worry, and replaying difficult moments come from — all these behaviors aided our survival back in the caveman days, so it made sense to have that kind of mental programming. However, the survival optimization of that internal code is what sends us on the pursuit of status and things rather than following the internal compass toward fulfillment.
The good news is — just like it’s possible to reprogram an app, it’s also possible to reprogram your mind and optimize it towards life satisfaction. You just need to know how to change that code; How to reprogram your internal mental programming.
Because what anyone and every one of us start with is a legacy code — passed on by generations, by our tribe, aka the people we grew up with, and experiences we’ve lived through, and the culture or society we grew up in. All these mixed together form that internal mental programming.
How are societies different? For example, capitalistic societies trade differently than communists. Developed nations trade differently than developing nations. In your opinion, how does society shape a human’s experience and feelings of satisfaction?
As I mentioned a moment ago — all of us start by having to deal with our legacy code — what we grew up believing, what we’ve experienced growing up, and that human experience varies significantly across cultures and nations.
I really like the Hofstede model for cultural comparisons and understanding how one’s culture affects their internal mental programming. It shines a light on what were some common themes of beliefs that were passed on.
It’s a tool that I used myself and now use with my immigrant clients to help them understand how the cultural values they grew up with are different from those valued at their workplace. We look into those differences and compare them against the personal values of my clients to get an understanding of how they have been stopping themselves from following their internal compass toward fulfillment.
For example, if you look up my home country, Poland, in Hofstede’s Country Comparison Tool, you’ll see that Indulgence (one of the six dimensions countries are compared on) is rather low, which essentially means that I grew up in a country and culture where you’re expected to restrain yourself and not indulge, not follow your passions, just do what is expected of you. And that had an enormous psychological effect on me giving myself permission to pursue things that would bring me more joy, satisfaction, and fulfillment but were against the norm, and against what was expected of me.
With a specific focus on brain function, how has the brain and its dominion over the body and beliefs been impacted by the societal construct?
We’re understanding more and more about the brain now, and the mind-body relationship.
And I think the Western World is now starting to catch up to the wisdom of the Eastern World. We’re essentially discovering now through scientific evidence, especially neuroscience, what’s been known to Buddhist Monks for centuries. Like the fact that meditation has incredibly powerful effects on the mind, brain, and body.
In the Western world, the societal construct has neglected the role of mindfulness, awareness, and self-exploration of a person’s life journey, to the point that just a few years or decades ago, seeing a therapist would’ve been considered shameful.
Thankfully societal construct is literally constructed by the society itself, so as we start talking about certain topics, that haven’t been previously discussed, we are literally changing that construct. And so a good example is how on social media more people are sharing their vulnerable stories about their mental health journeys, which is encouraging others, especially the younger generations to see this topic differently. Through conversations, we are changing the societal construct.
Do you think the way our society markets and advertises goods and services, has affected people’s feelings of satisfaction? Can you explain what you mean?
Yes. But…
These internal feelings of satisfaction can be easily affected by external factors, like marketing and advertising, if we are continuing to live on our legacy programming. So what I mean by this is — as long as you pursue what other people conditioned you to believe, you’re likely not going to be fulfilled, and you’ll be just chasing the shiny new thing that’s currently a trend; And you’ll do that without a deeper thought and understanding of whether or not that aligns with your personal values.
The moment you identify what it is that you actually want from life, that’s when you take control. That’s when you become aware of what kind of goods or services are actually serving you and which ones are not, and then regardless of how good the marketing is, you get to make your own independent choices that support your fulfillment.
How is the wiring of the brain, body, and beliefs shaped by marketing, language, and how humans trade?
Marketing, language, and human interactions, including trade, co-create culture. Marketing — talks about what’s desired and what’s not; Human trade — creates examples of trading value, so essentially teaches us what is valuable and presents some examples of how to treat one another; And language is a tool that describes the world accessible to us, and how we define what we experience, and how we share those experiences with others.
All these elements send cultural messages that are especially critical in shaping young human minds, which tend to receive and store information without any or much filtering. So these cultural messages essentially, influence our legacy programming. Our legacy programming, which represents our beliefs, then shapes our thoughts, which coordinate how our bodies function.
So, for example, if you grew up being culturally programmed to believe that it’s important to work until you’re physically exhausted, either through encouragement from parents or caregivers (where they trade a compliment only when they see you’ve put an enormous effort and are exhausted) the structure of your language or marketing;
Then likely, you will continue creating conditions in your life that reflect those unconscious patterns, you’ve observed most of your life. And so you will work more than what you actually need, which will likely create stress in your body, that will negatively affect your health. And more often than not, we do this to ourselves without even being aware.
Cause only when we’re aware of our thoughts, behaviors, and patterns, only then we have the power to change them and program in ourselves behaviors and beliefs that will change the course of our lives and increase our life satisfaction.
I work in marketing so I’m very cognizant of this question. In your opinion, how do you think marketing professionals can be more responsible for how their advertising shapes humans’ health and experience of happiness overall?
To an extent. And I say this because, ultimately, everyone is responsible for their own life and their own happiness. Without people taking ownership of their lives and happiness, I doubt marketing can provide a one-fits-all solution.
But one way for marketing professionals to become more supportive of humans’ health and experience of happiness is through embracing that everyone is different, and embracing a way of life that encourages self-discovery (whether through therapy, coaching, or consciousness medicines).
For you personally, if you have all your basic needs met, do you feel you have enough in life?
That’s something I’m definitely working towards, hahaha. Like everyone else, I have my own legacy beliefs to deal with, and every time I reach a new level of my life, some of those legacy beliefs that have not been fully reprogrammed come back up to the surface.
Okay, fantastic. Here is the main question of our interview: Can you share with our readers your “5 things we can each do to address the feeling of not having enough.”
Absolutely! To address the feeling of not having enough, you can take 5 steps to reprogram your mind. And just a quick reminder here — since the mind primarily consists of legacy programming, the reprogramming of the mind is very similar to reprograming an app.
When reprogramming an app, there are the following ingredients necessary to understand what’s not working and how to refactor (AKA improve the code): Debugger, breakpoints, and code analysis.
For the mind, these elements are equivalent to meditation, awareness, and 3rd party professional feedback.
Meditation helps to stay in touch with the thoughts roaming wild in mind and noticing what comes up internally.
Awareness of that internal experience helps us humans choose our behavior and how we show up in the external world. When we are aware, we get to show up differently, and we get to create more fulfillment for ourselves. Also, once we’re aware of the thoughts, we can dive deeper into the understanding of how we react and why we react the way we do (AKA, what experiences in our life programmed us to act and respond the way we do).
Feedback is necessary to notice the patterns and limiting beliefs hiding in the blind spot that are holding us back from creating that fulfilling life for ourselves.
So here are the 5 steps that you can take to address the feeling of not having enough:
- Start meditating. I love Balance App, that’s free for the first year, and teaches the fundamentals of meditation.
- Start journaling. Take some time to reflect on what’s really important for you in life. Once you answer the big questions, use journaling to notice and reflect on what’s been happening internally and what you’d prefer to happen instead, that way, you become more aware of who you are vs who you want to be.
- Engage in self-care activities. This can be yoga retreats, long walks in nature, or getting a relaxing massage. This way you give yourself time and space to disconnect from the daily hustle and get to know yourself from the inside.
- Talk to a professional, either a coach or a therapist, who knows how to spot your limiting beliefs and get their feedback on how you can reprogram your thinking.
- Choose who you want to be. Every day you get to choose how you want to show up in the world. You get to choose whether or not you want to be happy and fulfilled.
Of course, the last step is real easy to say, but not easy to actually implement. Because we are a sum of our experiences, and we’ve been programmed our entire lives to be who we currently are, and it takes work and effort to reprogram those decades of beliefs.
There is light at the end of the tunnel.
It is possible to become happier and more fulfilled, regardless of your starting point. Because when we’re aware of our thoughts, behaviors, and patterns, only then we have the power to change them and program in ourselves behaviors and beliefs that will increase our life satisfaction.
Do you have any favorite books, podcasts, or resources that have inspired you to live with more joy in life?
Yes, I have quite a few books that were especially powerful in changing my approach to life and specifically increasing the feelings of joy.
These books include:
- “The Happiness Trap: Stop Struggling, Start Living” by Russ Harris, which talks about the evolution of the human brain, and explains how to change your thinking using specific techniques.
- “Tapping for Wealth” by Margaret Lynch — helped me understand and process my baggage related to having more in my life.
- And my recent favorite “Breaking the Habit of Being Yourself: How to Lose Your Mind and Create a New One” by Dr. Joe Dispensa, that talks about the quantum physics of our reality and how our bodies’ biology, chemistry, and psychology have an effect on the quantum world around us.
These 3 books had an incredible impact on my life, and I highly recommend reading them.
You are a person of great influence. If you could start a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. 🙂
I would love to live in a world that values self-reflection and personal growth through exploration (whether that’s through therapy, coaching, or consciousness medicines).
One way to start could be by implementing in schools meditation classes, where kids and perhaps even their parents get to learn how to meditate, reflect and practice gratitude in a safe environment.
What is the best way for our readers to continue to follow your work online?
The best way is through my website: www.themindfuldev.com or if anyone is specifically interested in how I coach and what are the results my clients have experienced — I highly recommend watching the case study listed on my page. Watching the case study will also add their e-mail to my newsletter that I send out once a week. That way, whenever my book comes out, they will be the first ones to know.
Also, I highly recommend reaching out and connecting with me on LinkedIn: www.linkedin.com/in/dagnabieda
This was very inspiring. Thank you so much for the time you spent on this. We wish you only continued success.
About The Interviewer: For 30 years, Drew Gerber has been inspiring those who want to change the world. Drew is the CEO of Wasabi Publicity, Inc., a full-service PR agency lauded by PR Week and Good Morning America. Wasabi Publicity, Inc. is a global marketing company that supports industry leaders, change agents, unconventional thinkers, companies and organizations that strive to make a difference. Whether it’s branding, traditional PR or social media marketing, every campaign is instilled with passion, creativity and brilliance to powerfully tell their clients’ story and amplify their intentions in the world.
I Can’t Get No Satisfaction: Dagna Bieda Of the Mindful Dev On Why So Many Of Us Are Feeling… was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.