Engage more in the fun, celebratory aspects of life. I always kept a very tight grip on my activities from an early age. I walked away from parties if illegal drugs showed up — not always, but sometimes. Usually, I just ignored parties, concerts, and so on. In my late teens and early 20s my friends just stopped inviting me because they knew my likely answer. I was on the playground shooting hoops during my high school graduation and never went to the prom.
As a part of my series about “authors who are making an important social impact”, I had the pleasure of interviewing Gregory Leeson.
Gregory Leeson became a self-taught expert in various software engineering languages and co-founded Chinova Software, crafting innovative systems for renowned companies such as Sears Roebuck, Quaker Oats, and Abbott Laboratories. He’s more passionate about the 13 months he spent traveling around the United States, interviewing 71 strangers who would share their story with them. Sixty-six of them (five asked not to be included) are in Ordinary People, Extraordinary Lives: A Path to Reconciliation in Our Divided Time, published by Story Merchant Books, $14.99 paperback, $4.99 Kindle.
Thank you so much for joining us in this interview series! Before we dive into the main focus of our interview, our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you tell us a bit about your childhood backstory?
I grew up in Nova Scotia in the 1960s and 70s in a stable and highly responsible family. However, they were British descendants and thus I had a stereotypical unemotional upbringing. As I confirmed with my three siblings in 2018, we never heard the word “love.” But we sure had stability and a peaceful suburban environment. I was an athlete who had Olympic dreams for distance running until one day when I ran in a city school championship meet, won the 1500m race, walked off the track, and never ran again — the biggest mistake of my life. I had been one of the top 1500m runners in Canada for my age group — provincial record holder. I also was a bit of a math prodigy who skipped a grade after teaching myself addition and subtraction before entering any school, much to the surprise of my parents, and solved two problems in grade nine that I later discovered had been solved by famous mathematicians many years before. One was Carl Gauss who, like me, solved the problem as a schoolboy.
My father was a civil engineer who worked for the telephone company his entire life. My mother never worked after she married. They were wonderful providers and there was no drama in the house. Also, there was no emotion and little involvement in their children’s lives as long as they were doing well. I began to separate myself from my family in grade four. I had my first epileptic seizure then, stopped reading fiction (other than that required by the school), and my teacher wrote to my parents that I was “living in his own world.” I am sure she meant it as a warning. Since I did well in school, played sports, and basically kept away from the party scene, my parents left me alone. I started to read biographies. I probably read more biographies between the ages of 10 and 17 than most people will read in a lifetime. Those books taught me how to think. They have been the single greatest influence on my life. And so, I emerged from high school thinking that anything was possible.
When you were younger, was there a book that you read that inspired you to take action or changed your life? Can you share a story about that?
There are multiple biographies that I could cite. But, here’s a good one. I Am Third. It is the story of Gale Sayers, a great football player. I Am Third is a philosophy — God, Others, Self. Here is a story as it is written in the appendix section of my book about my life.
A fortnight after winning the provincial 1500m championship for 14-year-olds, I eagerly entered another track meet, which presented an opportunity to distinguish myself. Here, I would compete in a track/cross country race featuring Brian Malone, the provincial 16-year-old 1500-meter champion. Open to those under 17, this event held tremendous potential for my growth as a runner. Shortly after the starting gun fired, I found myself in a familiar position: in last place, a strategy I had learned from my athletic idol, Kip Keino, the 1968 Mexico City Olympic hero.
The first runner I prepared to pass was a young boy, hardly more than eight years old. Just as I was about to overtake him, a profound sense of purpose overcame me, guiding me toward a greater mission that day. I stayed by the young boy’s side as the race progressed, offering continuous encouragement. As we made our way back into the stadium for the final stretch of 120 meters, the vibrant cheers of the crowd resonated. Some among them undoubtedly recognized me and comprehended the unfolding scenario. I urged the young runner to unleash his best effort for the last 50 meters. Ultimately, I finished in last place.
Upon crossing the finish line, I paused momentarily before returning to congratulate him. However, I never got the chance. The boy’s mother emerged from the spectators and enveloped her child in a warm embrace. With a contented smile, I walked away, confident I had fulfilled the purpose set before me that day. Later, Brian confided in me, expressing that he had searched for me during the race, curious about my whereabouts. He had been eagerly anticipating the competition, as had I. I explained I had other obligations to attend to. This anecdote resurfaces in my thoughts whenever I encounter moments of self-doubt as a reminder of my inherent value as a human being.
The inspiration behind my actions that day stemmed from the biography I Am Third, which recounts Gale Sayers’s life. The book’s core philosophy — prioritizing God, Others, and Self in that order — resonated deeply with me.
It has been said that our mistakes can be our greatest teachers. Can you share a story about the funniest mistake you made when you were first starting? Can you tell us what lesson you learned from that?
Funny mistake? Is that not an oxymoron? Well, here is an oversight perhaps more than a mistake, but was certainly funny in its own way. In Saint Louis, while I was on my Western Journey, I was met with something no man wants to hear in public, “Sir, zip up your fly.” I’m retired now, so I guess it was just a matter of time. Apparently, I had been parading around town and entered the Arch of Saint Louis with the barn door open. It took a National Park Security Ranger to set things straight. I think the lesson is obvious.
Can you describe how you aim to make a significant social impact with your book?
There are two ways. I interviewed 71 people with an in-depth life protocol developed by Dr. Dan McAdams, a renowned academic in “narrative psychology.” Thirty of the 71 people cried during the interview — it is that deep. Most of these people were total strangers to me. I hope that these interviewees experienced something unique and profound that cascades.
Secondly, for the people who read the mini-biographies (there are 66 of the 71), I hope that they learn that we all have so much more in common than that which is different. I hope it breeds empathy. Then, I hope that they read Appendix A which is the protocol that McAdams has graciously allowed me to reproduce. If they use that, I am convinced that they will extoll its virtues so that it cascades also.
Can you share with us the most interesting story that you shared in your book?
I could provide 66 answers to this question. But let’s take a different approach. My book provided 52 opinions from anonymous people from all over the United States on where the country is, how divided we are, how to address the division, and where we are headed. It was all a part of my book’s theme. However, the most interesting part of this section is a subsection titled, “Morehouse College vs. Wichita State University.” Same question — two different views of the world emerged. The two Morehouse students were black, the two Wichita students were white. Georgia and Iowa.
What was the “aha moment” or series of events that made you decide to bring your message to the greater world? Can you share a story about that?
In 2015 I was the emcee at my 40th high school reunion. I heard a lot of stories that night. I wondered whether anyone had ever written a book about ordinary people. But, being a math guy and not a letters guy, I dismissed the idea. No talent. Fast forward to the summer of 2019 when I am on a date and the woman stops me mid-sentence and asks if I ever thought of writing a book. I told her I had one book in me. I told her the idea and she told me to go for it. So, I did. Four road trips covering exactly one year, one month, one week, and one day, 26,403 miles, 53 cities, 39 states and eight Canadian provinces later, I have a book. I never saw her again.
Without sharing specific names, can you tell us a story about a particular individual who was impacted or helped by your cause?
Liz. She is an interviewee who wrote a most remarkable review of the interview. I chose her review to be in my book. I was the first person to whom she had told her “Real” story. She was one of the criers. I met her on a street in Seattle. I interviewed her three weeks later in Los Angeles where she lived. The process lifted the weight she had carried for years. She was free! She tells me she thinks of our short time together all the time.
Are there three things the community/society/politicians can do to help you address the root of the problem you are trying to solve?
Invite someone you know (but you really don’t) and have a real talk. And I don’t mean about that great sushi bar you just discovered. After that is done, assuming the experience is eye-opening, encourage others you know to do the same. Finally, if someone is reticent, direct them to https://humanlibrary.org/. My idea is not unique or weird.
How do you define “Leadership”? Can you explain what you mean or give an example?
I am convinced that the only long-term philosophy of leadership that works is leading from behind. Now I understand that there are circumstances where this is not always practical. Think military engagement. However, I think the vast majority of people will always respond positively to a leader who genuinely has his/her direct reports’ interests first and foremost on his/her mind. This takes time because it is all about trust. It is “soft” not “hard.” It promotes, it never demeans. And when the you-know-what hits the fan, the leader steps to the forefront to take the hit. I could go on forever, but I think you get my drift.
What are your “5 things I wish someone told me when I first started” and why?
Engage more in the fun, celebratory aspects of life. I always kept a very tight grip on my activities from an early age. I walked away from parties if illegal drugs showed up — not always, but sometimes. Usually, I just ignored parties, concerts, and so on. In my late teens and early 20s my friends just stopped inviting me because they knew my likely answer. I was on the playground shooting hoops during my high school graduation and never went to the prom.
Connect better with people. I am much better at this now than I was when I was a young man.
Shmooze up to college professors.
Get involved in public speaking early. I LOVE the process now but that did not happen until I was in my 50s. Today, all my friends call me an extravert.
That I was right to not worry about what people thought of me. It made things lonely at times but it would have been great to have heard it from an authority figure who I respected.
Can you please give us your favorite “Life Lesson Quote”? Can you share how that was relevant to you in your life?
Start a huge, foolish project, like Noah… It makes absolutely no difference what people think of you.
Rumi 1207–1273
I came across this quote within the past 10 years but I have lived it my entire life. I think it is why that woman stopped me mid-sentence when I was relating parts of my life and she asked me if I had thought of writing a book. Following up on this in 2022, I gave my daughter a framed document for Christmas when she was studying at the University of Paris with two sentences I crafted. After a brief preamble, I wrote The Two Rules:
- For anything you do, have no fear.
- For anything you do, there is no substitute for preparation.
I wrote that if she lived her life with these as her North Star, life would turn out fine.
Is there a person in the world, or in the US with whom you would like to have a private breakfast or lunch with, and why? He or she might just see this, especially if we tag them. 
Xi Jinping, President of China. His actions over the next 10 years will impact humanity more than any other individual. Of course, I doubt he would be very forthcoming. What are the chances you can make this happen? 
. My daughter is adopted from China so I have been to the country.
How can our readers further follow your work online?
My website is https://gregoryleesonbooks.com/.
This was very meaningful, thank you so much. We wish you only continued success on your great work!
Social Impact Authors: How & Why Author Gregory Leeson Is Helping To Change Our World was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.