Chef James Griffin of Johnson & Wales University: 5 Things I Wish Someone Told Me Before I Became a Chef
An Interview With Martita Mestey
Culinary school teaches more than cooking. Don’t listen to the detractors who say culinary school isn’t worth it, even if they are celebrity chefs. The idea of attending “the school of hard knocks” over culinary school due to cost may save money in the short run but could be far more costly over time. A good culinary education includes more than cooking — it teaches you how to think and exposes you to far more than food. Courses in the arts, sciences, and humanities provide a broad perspective on the world. Courses in business and management build soft skills. Good culinary schools also have a deep pool of alumni who serve as a professional resource after graduation.
As a part of our series about the lessons from influential ‘TasteMakers’, I had the distinct pleasure of interviewing Chef James Griffin.
Chef James Griffin is a former member and multiple gold medal winner of the U.S. Culinary Olympic team, executive chef, and professor. Griffin has worked with Johnson & Wales University for over two decades where he has held several senior roles including associate provost and vice president of academic affairs, and also serves as director of the Chilean Salmon Marketing Council. On his road to becoming a chef, Griffin studied with renowned culinarians including Raymond Blanc, Jean Louis Palladin, and Madeline Kamman. He’s also been featured on NBC’s The Today Show multiple times and has worked in endless areas in the culinary field including as president and CEO of the former Coolfish division of Slade Gorton.
Thank you so much for doing this with us! Our readers would love to “get to know” you a bit. Can you share with our readers a story about what inspired you to become a restauranteur or chef?
Like so many chefs, I was drawn to the profession out of the joy I get from making other people happy through cooking and sharing food. It began in elementary school when I would help my grandmother in the kitchen as she prepared baked goods for Sunday supper. My grandparents owned a commercial garden center with four large greenhouses and a half-acre vegetable garden in the back. They harvested and cooked fresh fruits and vegetables all season long, while also enjoying abundant locally caught seafood. I still dream of the vine-ripened tomatoes warm from the sun, perfectly ripe blueberries and raspberries, and delicious root vegetables in the autumn. Our large family congregated on the weekends and food was at the center of our life. When the food was good, everyone was joyful. I became addicted to that type of joy!
This eventually led to my first job in a commercial kitchen way back in 1980 and then to the culinary program at Johnson & Wales University, where I graduated in 1988 with my BS degree. My inspiration began at home and blossomed while at culinary school. More than 40 years later, I still have an endearing love for the foodservice profession (though my knees hurt now, lol).
Do you have a specific type of food that you focus on? What first drew you to cooking that type of food? Can you share a story about that with us?
My favorite type of food to prepare is seafood due to where I was raised. Growing up in Gloucester, Massachusetts, America’s oldest fishing port, provided early access to some of the freshest seafood in the country. Though much has changed, seafood still defines my hometown. Our high school mascot is a fisherman, and the name of our football team is the Fishermen. We are fishermen in name and culture, and we grew up chasing, catching, selling, cooking, eating, and dreaming about fish. Back when I was a kid, the fish we lived and breathed were cod, haddock, and their cousins, like whiting, pollock, hake, and cusk, plus abundant local soft-shell clams, mussels, and lobster. These species were so plentiful the docks were constantly busy, and people regularly brought excess catch to our home. I had family members with boats on the water fishing and others who spent time on the flats digging clams. According to my family, the first seafood I ever ate was a fried soft-shell clam when I was 18 months old. You could truthfully say I was weaned on seafood.
Fast-forward to today and I am proud to share that my reputation as a seafood expert is now firmly established, having worked for the Norwegian Seafood Export Council, the former Slade Gorton & Co. in Boston, and more recently the Chilean Salmon Marketing Council. Seafood is my thing! I still love working with it.
Can you share the funniest or most interesting story that has happened to you since you became a chef? What was the lesson or takeaway you took from that story?
My job in the kitchen has put me in contact with so many interesting people and situations. This includes cooking for the likes of comedian Chris Rock; musicians Dave Matthews and James Taylor (and his band); iconic people like Art Buchwald, Beverly Sills, and Walter Cronkite; and tech gurus like Mark Zuckerberg and many others. I even cooked for Julia Child and her husband, Paul, early in my career.
One of my favorite stories is about Chef Jacques Pépin. Back in May 2010, when I was serving as the associate provost for Johnson & Wales, I had the pleasure of cohosting a dinner in Miami that included Jacques, Tim and Nina Zagat of Zagat Guide, and Chef Jean Jacques Dietrich, formerly of the New York Athletic Club. Jacques and the Zagats were scheduled to receive honorary doctorate degrees the following day. One day later, after the ceremony and festivities concluded, I prepared to head to the airport to catch my flight home. Jacques and I were staying in the same hotel, so I took time to track him down to say goodbye before leaving. His flight was later that evening too — he was headed to Connecticut while I was going to Rhode Island. Without missing a beat, he made two calls and changed his flight so he could join me on my plane to Providence. My flight wasn’t full, so we made adjustments to our seats at the check-in desk and wound up flying in coach with an empty seat between us. For three hours, he shared stories of his life, his work, his time working with Julia Child and how he wrote his own books. He told tender stories about his daughter, Claudine, his granddaughter, Shorey, and his wife, Gloria — clearly the loves of his life. Periodically, someone on the flight would come over to him and ask for a picture or tell him how much they loved his work. He always obliged with a smile and grace. Jacques is one of my culinary heroes, and the humility and generosity he showed that day still leaves me speechless. More than a decade later, I still spend time with Jacques, and he remains equally generous and full of grace. The older I get, the more I try to be like Jacques and model his humility, grace, and generosity in both my personal and professional lives.
Can you tell us a story about the hard times that you faced when you first started your journey? How did you overcome them?
When I was 17 years old and in my first year of culinary school, I was scheduled to take a course known as AM Cafeteria. The course started at 5:00 am and continued until noon in the student dining center. Our job was to make breakfast for 900 students while also prepping for lunch and dinner. On the first day of the course — just weeks into the hands-on part of my degree program — the chef instructor, a rather rough, small, and short-tempered man who could be a twin of Chef Skinner from the animated film Ratatouille, assigned me the task of draining and cleaning three 100-gallon steam kettles. Calling me to attention after a brief lecture, he yelled, “Griffin, get your ass over here and drain and clean these three kettles — and don’t take all morning doing it.” It was 5:45 am and I had never seen kettles that big, but I was cocky and up to the task. With a spring in my step, I drained the first kettle — tilting out all the bones, vegetables, and aromatics — and then scrubbed and hosed it down. Chef passed by just as I was about to start cleaning the next kettle and stopped to ask where I put the 80 gallons of chicken stock that had been simmering in the first kettle since the previous evening. I quickly pointed to the floor drain. He had never said to save the liquid, and I was too inexperienced to know the liquid was finished chicken stock. “You jackass. What the hell is wrong with you? If you don’t know what you are doing, ASK!” he exclaimed while marching me back to the walk-in to assemble all the ingredients to make another batch of stock. Man, I was embarrassed and quickly realized how much I had to learn and how much common sense I lacked. From that point forward, I taught myself how to stop and think throughout the workday — to periodically pause and assess what I am doing and make notes of any questions or corrections. This is a practice I still employ daily.
In your experience, what is the key to creating a dish that customers are crazy about?
For this question, I have to give credit to one of the best chefs America has ever known: Roger Fessaguet. For 20 years, Roger was chef at New York’s four-star La Caravelle restaurant on West 55th Street (near 5th Avenue) where he served many famous guests including John F. Kennedy. I was lucky for the opportunity to spend three days with Roger at his home in West Palm Beach, Florida. Through hours of conversation, Roger emphasized the importance of intimately knowing customer preferences. Roger always focused first on the customer when creating a new menu item. He knew his customers well, right down to the time of day they preferred to visit and the tables in the dining room they favored. He also knew what he liked to prepare and eat, and always made the final decision about a new menu item based on both customer and personal preference. At the end of the day, a chef has to love the food he or she prepares and strive to ensure customers crave it too. When both are aligned, the probability of success will increase.
Personally, what is the “perfect meal” for you?
To me, a perfect meal is one that is perfectly prepared, with service calibrated to the audience and occasion. My best meals have been ones where this has been true. For example, in 2012, I took my wife, Christine (also a chef), and two children (ages 10 and 14) on a trip to Italy and we had lunch at Osteria Francescana in Modena. Chef Massimo Bottura had just received his third Michelin Star and the restaurant was receiving global acclaim. My wife and I were nervous about bringing our kids to such a highly ranked restaurant but decided the opportunity was too great to miss.
The meal started spectacularly but quickly shifted when our 10-year-old son grew restless and stopped eating. Mid-meal he decided he had had enough. After clearing the course in front of us, our server noticed right away and leaned in and asked my son if he wanted spaghetti and meatballs or tortellini with parmesan. We were mortified and thought he must have pegged us for American tourists with less-than-stellar taste. However, our son’s eyes lit up when the offer was made, and he immediately asked for tortellini. Our server said they would make it fresh just for him and disappeared into the kitchen. Fifteen minutes later, our server returned with a steaming hot bowl of the most beautiful and delicious freshly made tortellini in parmesan sauce we had ever seen. Our son’s eyes widened, and his mouth grew into a massive smile — his first in two days. He was delighted. We were delighted. His sister was so delighted she asked for a bowl, too. For the next 90 minutes, my wife and I enjoyed eight more courses of some of the finest food and service we have ever had, while both our son and daughter enjoyed three more custom-made kids’ menu items just for them. It remains one of our finest dining experiences. The restaurant staff read our table and adjusted to ensure everyone at the table had the best possible experience. They went out of their way and beyond the norm to accommodate us and make us feel joyful.
Later, we learned that the restaurant had devised a culture of universal accommodation and hospitality. Chef Massimo and his wife, Lara, were fond of kids and families and had a plan for people just like us. What happened that day was not impromptu or a pleasant accident. We didn’t catch them off guard or cause a ripple in their service. They had a plan for excellence, regardless of the situation; it was part of their ethos. Our visit remains the benchmark dining experience of our lives. The service was expertly calibrated to our group and the occasion.
Where does your inspiration for creating come from? Is there something that you turn to for a daily creativity boost?
My favorite way to stay inspired is through travel and what I call “benchmark dining.” A benchmark is a standard or point of reference against which things may be compared or assessed. Benchmark dining focuses on eating at the best restaurant within a given segment in a city of your choice. The restaurant doesn’t have to be fancy — it could be a pizza parlor, an independent quick-service restaurant, or a local diner. So long as the restaurant sits at the top of its category, it qualifies for a visit.
The goal of a benchmark visit is to learn from the restaurant’s operation. This involves a formal tasting of key menu items (I always take photos, too), a kitchen tour (if possible), and time spent with the owner or manager to learn what makes the place tick. Some of the best meals of my life have occurred while out on a benchmark trip. They’re always exciting, and great restauranteurs love to share their success stories. Traveling is also fun and opens my eyes to new cultures and foodways.
Are you working on any new or exciting projects now? What impact do you think this will have?
In recent years, I have become far more active in sustainability initiatives related to food and our commercial supply chain. An example is my work with the Chilean Salmon Antibiotic Reduction Program (CSARP) in collaboration with Monterey Bay Aquarium’s Seafood Watch and the Chilean salmon industry. The program includes leading environmental and seafood scientists and industry professionals focused on improving the environmental sustainability of the Chilean salmon industry.
The project is one of the largest of its kind in the world and has the potential to dramatically improve salmon aquaculture while ensuring a steady supply of one of the healthiest proteins available — one the USDA recommends we consume more often. Though the short-term progress of CSARP has been limited, the long-term potential is significant. More importantly, the project involves a level of unprecedented collaboration between industry, academia, and a global NGO. It is an honor to be part of the group.
What advice would you give to other chefs or restaurateurs to thrive and avoid burnout?
Self-care has gained significant attention over the past four years, and this is highly justified. The culinary profession is unique when it comes to hours worked, the physical nature of the work environment, and the pressure that occurs on an ongoing nightly basis. Working in a busy restaurant is not for the faint of heart. Along the road to becoming a chef, few ever tell us about the need for self-care; the need to rest and recharge our batteries. As a result, I recommend every chef devise a system for taking care of themselves. No one else is going to do it — you must do it for yourself. Here are four considerations for staying healthy:
- Stay physically healthy. Keep your weight under control, exercise regularly, stay off the substances, and be sure to rest. Smart chefs maintain their health.
- Invest in your mental health and know how to recognize when you are in distress. Don’t be afraid to talk with a counselor if necessary and take your mental health seriously. Smart chefs know when to ask for help.
- Always remind yourself that ethics matter and reputations and careers are lost in a moment of poor decision-making or lapsed judgment. Smart chefs make ethics a priority.
- Take time for yourself and for the things you enjoy outside of the kitchen. Don’t let your life become one-dimensional or you will burn out. Smart chefs spend time on more than cooking.
Thank you for all that. Now we are ready for the main question of the interview. What are your five things you wish someone told you when you first started as a chef, and why? Please share a story or an example for each.
- Culinary school teaches more than cooking. Don’t listen to the detractors who say culinary school isn’t worth it, even if they are celebrity chefs. The idea of attending “the school of hard knocks” over culinary school due to cost may save money in the short run but could be far more costly over time. A good culinary education includes more than cooking — it teaches you how to think and exposes you to far more than food. Courses in the arts, sciences, and humanities provide a broad perspective on the world. Courses in business and management build soft skills. Good culinary schools also have a deep pool of alumni who serve as a professional resource after graduation.
- Be sure to master finance, human resources, and marketing (what I call business competency) in addition to food preparation. Young cooks often dedicate their time to mastering culinary methods and techniques but forget about the bigger picture. Time must also be spent learning the other competencies required to run a successful business. Operating a profitable restaurant is not an easy task; it requires tremendous discipline and expertise that goes well beyond the kitchen. On more than one occasion, I have watched an outstanding chef with some of the best food served in a given city go out of business not because of the food or service but due to underdeveloped business competency. The lesson learned? Great food and service aren’t enough. The sooner you learn about finance, human resources, and marketing the better.
- Learn to be confident but with a degree of humility. The era of the ego-driven chef is behind us. Our profession calls for chefs with confidence and humility. Watching chefs scream at people on TV makes me shudder — our industry doesn’t work that way. We are professionals privileged to serve guests to the best of our ability. Our profession is a noble one, not a ship of pirates loose at sea.
- Later in your career, don’t be afraid to work for yourself and live your dream. The foodservice industry exceeded $1 trillion in sales in 2022 as consumer demand rebounded from the pandemic. That’s more than $2.7 billion in sales per day (not including grocery stores). This is an astronomical number. In addition, the U.S. needs approximately 25,000 head chefs each year, with positions often going unfilled. The demand for restaurants and culinary leadership is huge and unlikely to shrink. People will not outsource their food to a foreign manufacturer, nor will their food production move online. The opportunities for food entrepreneurs have never been higher, and young chefs must be encouraged to live their dream.
- Take care of yourself. I learned midway through my career to take better care of myself. Once I became aware of the link between self-care and performance, I sought out the best people for advice and guidance. One of my favorite people in this space is my friend Chef/Doctor Uma Naidoo. Uma is a doctor at Mass General Hospital and part of the faculty at Harvard Medical School. She’s also a chef who graduated at the top of her class from culinary school. Her writings on the link between diet and mental and physical health have changed my life. It would have been even better physically if I had learned these lessons in my 20s rather than my 40s.
What’s the one dish people have to try if they visit your establishment?
If I were to cook for you, the menu would rotate but feature seafood, with an emphasis on salmon due to my work with the Chilean Salmon Marketing Council. At present, one of my favorites is the grilled Atlantic salmon with rice wine and strawberry salsa we developed. With summer and strawberry season just months away, this is the perfect item for summer grilling. Don’t be afraid to cook seafood at home. It really is easy to cook, and the results can be both affordable and delicious.
You are a person of enormous influence. If you could inspire a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger.
Independent restaurants are a place of joy and respite that often serve as the center of a community. Let’s inspire a movement of support and loyalty for our favorite eating and drinking places — one that includes tolerance for the complexities restaurateurs face on a daily basis. Rising rent, food, and labor costs have really put a damper on the industry. Labor shortages are worse than ever. Through it all restaurant operators persist and do their best to serve guests, even when it is difficult. Showing loyalty and a vote of support when you visit inspires members of the industry to keep going. Take time to support your favorite restaurants and they will live on to happily host you another day!
Thank you so much for these insights. This was very inspirational!
Chef James Griffin of Johnson & Wales University: 5 Things I Wish Someone Told Me Before I Became a… was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.