An Interview With Vanessa Ogle
Education: The more information that you obtain through reading, research, and social interactions, the easier it is to accept people and ideas that differ from yours. You must be open minded when delving into this task, and be sure not to seek knowledge through the lens of your biases.
In a world where diversity is often acknowledged but not always celebrated, we are taking a step forward to highlight the importance of inclusivity in building strong, vibrant communities. This series aims to explore the various facets of diversity — be it racial, cultural, gender-based, or within the differently-abled community — and understand how embracing these differences strengthens our social fabric. As part of this series, we had the pleasure of interviewing Patrick Jones.
In the world of social media, “Mr. Jones” is a well-known speaker, debater, educator, and advocate for the marginalized. Both parasocially and across many communities, his activism is well-known and widely respected. His mastery of intersectionality and the importance of advocating from the bottom up distinguish him from the average content creator. These abilities have earned him numerous speaking engagements, invitations to panel discussions, and national attention for his debates. Furthermore, he is an entrepreneur with a brilliant socially conscious clothing company, in which his products are manufactured by a local minority women-owned business and the designs allow customers to wear their protest. In addition, the clothing is made of recycled materials. Although “Mr. Jones” is well accomplished, his journey has only just begun, and his mission is far from complete. He aspires to change the world, one heart and mind at a time.
Thank you so much for joining us in this interview series. Before we dive into our discussion about celebrating diversity, our readers would love to “get to know you” a bit better. Can you share with us the backstory about what brought you to your specific career path?
When I initially entered the workforce, I was met with the harsh reality that even my name could prevent me from obtaining employment. It seems that neither my education nor my experience were enough for me to overcome the fact that having an “ethnic” sounding name was enough for me to not even be called back for an interview. So, my first life-altering action as an adult was to remove my tribal name and take on the last name Jones (the sur name of my father). I knew moving forward that it was imperative for me to work exponentially harder to earn a place in corporate America but also to ascend the ranks. It was because of this that I made the decision to create a pathway for marginalized communities to enter the workforce and expand knowledge of intersectionality in any organization or community that I found myself a part of.
Can you share an interesting or hopeful story where spending time with someone who did not look like you or who was different from you taught you something that has been useful to you?
In my extensive career in corporate growth strategy, marketing, and community outreach, I have had the pleasure to meet people from across the globe. I have learned so many aspects of international cultures and traditions. It is my belief that finding common ground while showing genuine interest in the differences amongst you gives you the ability to build lasting bonds and mutual respect. The most important ideal that I have learned is that we are all interconnected and our survival is dependent on one another, much like flowers need bees and humans need trees.
You are a successful leader. Which three character traits do you think were most instrumental to your success? Can you please share a story or example for each?
In all honesty, I don’t believe that a leader can define or appoint themselves as such. I believe that the community or organization that an individual belongs to should be the determining body. Furthermore, I believe that leadership should be egalitarian in nature and should involve the wants, needs, and input of all those you wish to serve. Additionally, leadership should be a bottom-up approach. By focusing on the material conditions of the most marginalized among you, in this very praxis, you would be accomplishing the goals of the whole.
As much as I want to tell a story of my accomplishments, I don’t believe I would be answering in good faith by claiming that I am a successful leader without acknowledging that in no aspect of the positions I was appointed was I able to accomplish anything without enormous participation from other individuals. Be it their labor, their ideas, their encouragement, or their time, any measure of success that has been bestowed upon me is directly attributed to the success of the group.
Ok, thank you for that. Let’s now jump to the primary focus of our interview. Can you share a personal story that highlights the impact of diversity and inclusivity in your life or career?
The Tuff (Transformative Uprising for Freedom) Family is the best example of how diversity and inclusion can be the foundation of an amazing movement. Our community includes people of all races, religions, ethnicities, genders, sexual orientations, and physical abilities. They rely on each other for comfort, mutual aid, education, jobs, access to resources, and so much more. Even though it began as a solo project, it has grown into one of the most beautiful families a person could hope for. Over the last three years, we have been able to provide housing to those in DV and other housing insecure situations. Covered the medical expenses of hundreds of individuals. Provided thousands of dollars in groceries to households in need. Employed and worked to grow countless small businesses within marginalized demographics. Most importantly, we have been able to not only teach how diversity is power, but we have also been able to show it in action.
How do you approach and manage the challenges that arise when working towards creating more inclusive communities?
You have to first understand that ideas that are contrary to one’s core beliefs or the core institutions that exist within a societal framework are going to be met with resistance. This wish to oppose change is the result of an amygdala response, or your body’s fight or flight system. It is a reaction to a real or perceived threat. Now I know people will ask, “What is the threat?” and the answer is that people believe that if an individual or group is given more rights or access to resources, somehow they will receive less. The truth is, in almost all cases, there is no basis for this fear, and the only thing being lost is the ability to continue oppressing this group.
Managing these fears requires two things: first, empathy, because we understand what is going on, and second, education. Now that we have connected with the individual and acknowledged/validated their feelings, you can help them unpack, unlearn, and then relearn better coping skills and social behaviors through intersectional thought.
What innovative strategies or initiatives have you implemented or observed that effectively promote the importance of diversity and inclusivity?
Culturally responsive pedigogee/teaching is, in my opinion, the most innovative strategy I have implemented and believe should be a core component of our educational system. To eliminate the divisions within our society, we must have representation of the children we serve in our schools and community in positions of authority, education, and social work. In this same vein, when building an organization, it is imperative that the communities being served are represented in the organization seeking to serve them. It is also necessary to make sure that the various members of the organization or community learn cultural aspects of one another, such as simple greetings and conversational words in each other’s native language. This alone connects the separate entities by way of communication. Further, it is beneficial to be aware of various cultural celebrations, holidays, and rituals so that you may make them feel accepted and recognized on a more intimate level.
In your opinion, what are the key elements that make a community truly inclusive, and how can these be fostered on a larger scale?
This is simple. When a community is truly inclusive — those who require the most in terms of resources that would allow them to sustain material conditions that are equitable to those who require little to no accommodations — you have created real inclusivity. I have listed several measures by which this can be achieved and scaled. The most important of those mentioned is starting with the most marginalized and working your way up.
Based on your experience and research, can you please share “5 Ways We Can Build Inclusive Communities”? I
1. Humanize one another: We must stop viewing ourselves solely through the lens of our social identities and recognize that everything was created as a system of categorization. However, we are more than any of those social identities, but rather a combination of them all. Finally, and most importantly, we are all humans who deserve dignity, love, and respect.
One way to implement this is to ask someone to tell you about themselves and what is most important to them outside of these social constructs. When you learn about who the person is, you will find that you may have more in common than not, and even if you don’t, you see them as a person and not a category.
2 . Education: The more information that you obtain through reading, research, and social interactions, the easier it is to accept people and ideas that differ from yours. You must be open minded when delving into this task, and be sure not to seek knowledge through the lens of your biases.
Nearly ten years ago, my sibling came out to me as trans. My interactions between those within the trans community were limited at best and I was not well educated in the matter. Since then, I have read countless books, studied the science, stayed up-to-date with the laws, and learned how to best advocate for them.
3 . Representation: Inclusive communities require intersectional representation and an understanding of how to meet the needs of those within the intersectional framework.
If you were to build a community center, you would staff with people from various intersections who can not only ensure that the needs of their respective communities are met but also create an environment where the community feels seen, appreciated, and welcome.
4 . Empathy: The ability to empathize with others ties all of the previous ideas together. When you can see things through the eyes of those who have different experiences than you, you can get a sense of how our society affects their lives.
The path to changing minds is by first changing their hearts.
5 . Action: Engage in the community. Turn the ideas into action. Create organizations. Get involved in local schools, politics, and advocacy.
How do you measure the impact and success of diversity and inclusion efforts, and what changes have you seen as a result of these initiatives?
Success is defined by the people you influence to change their perspectives on the world and their willingness to work together for the greater good. In schools, this typically manifests as a decrease in emotional and physical violence among students, as well as unity among faculty and administrators. This environment promotes higher academic performance while lowering student dropouts and faculty turnover. In the workplace, this takes a similar form. Higher productivity, job satisfaction, and thus lower turnover all contribute to a more successful organization.
You are a person of great influence. If you could start a movement that would bring the most amount of good to the most amount of people, what would that be? You never know what your idea can trigger. 🙂
I think the TUFF Fam is the start of such a movement. We aim to build a community that does what our government has failed to do: provide for the general welfare of the people. To change the hearts, minds, and material conditions of as many marginalized and underserved individuals as we can.
We have built this platform from the ground up via social media, and we plan to take that momentum to cities and towns across America, affecting real change where people can use it most.
How can our readers further follow you online?
I can be found on TikTok @Mr.JonesX
YouTube @Mr.Jones_X
Instagram @Mr.Jones_X and
Twitch @tufflifestyle
Thank you for the time you spent sharing these fantastic insights. We wish you continued success in your great work!
About The Interviewer: Vanessa Ogle is a mom, entrepreneur, inventor, writer, and singer/songwriter. Vanessa’s talent in building world-class leadership teams focused on diversity, a culture of service, and innovation through inclusion allowed her to be one of the most acclaimed Latina CEO’s in the last 30 years. She collaborated with the world’s leading technology and content companies such as Netflix, Amazon, HBO, and Broadcom to bring innovative solutions to travelers and hotels around the world. Vanessa is the lead inventor on 120+ U.S. Patents. Accolades include: FAST 100, Entrepreneur 360 Best Companies, Inc. 500 and then another six times on the Inc. 5000. Vanessa was personally honored with Inc. 100 Female Founder’s Award, Ernst and Young’s Entrepreneur of the Year Award, and Enterprising Women of the Year among others. Vanessa now spends her time sharing stories to inspire and give hope through articles, speaking engagements and music. In her spare time she writes and plays music in the Amazon best selling new band HigherHill, teaches surfing clinics, trains dogs, and cheers on her children.
Please connect with Vanessa here on linkedin and subscribe to her newsletter Unplugged as well as follow her on Substack, Instagram, Facebook, and X and of course on her website VanessaOgle.
Celebrating Diversity: Patrick Jones Of The T.U.F.F. Family On How To Build Inclusive Communities was originally published in Authority Magazine on Medium, where people are continuing the conversation by highlighting and responding to this story.